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Posts Tagged ‘online discernment ministry’

T.D. Jakes Exposed For The Heretical Liar That He Is And What It Means For The Church

Posted by Job on January 26, 2012

All right folks. I said that I was going to give this online discernment ministry thing up. The first reason was that there were too many false teachers and doctrines to keep track of. The second reason was that based on my interactions with those following these false preachers even after their unBiblical scandalous doctrines and behavior had been exposed that folks were going to believe what they choose to believe anyway. The third was that I had felt that I had adequately addressed the issue with the 3 years of blogging that I did dedicate to the topic. The fourth was that I felt that the best way to combat error was with the truth, so I decided to take this site in a more exegetical direction. And the last of those was also chosen for practical reasons: I no longer have the time to answer comments and interact with people that I did back when I made exposing false teachers so writing about scripture’s meaning and application seemed to be a superior use of time (and yes I do need to get back to writing about the Bible).

But the T.D. Jakes issue is timely right now due to Jakes’ recent appearance at a respected evangelical event of some estimation where he was “interviewed” by Mark Driscoll, where the topic of Jakes’ rejection of the Holy Trinity was discussed. Now I don’t mean to attack anybody, but one Christian blogger quickly proclaimed Jakes’s statement satisfies me that he is a Trinitarian and that we should celebrate that Jakes has joined the Trinitarian camp. (Which, er, makes all his time as a false preaching modalist heretic and the people that he deceived during that time “ok” I guess. The truth is that at best he was an unregenerate false teacher when he was in the pulpit before, and even if he believes in the Holy Trinity NOW and is born again NOW, he has no business in the pulpit. His previous experience and service is worthless, and he needs to take his place in the pews learning from an actual Christian pastor. Otherwise, we can go get Jewish rabbis, Catholic priests, Buddhist monks, Muslim imams, and liberal “Christians” who perform homosexual “marriage” ceremonies and put them into the pulpit immediately after they say a salvation prayer.)

Another Christian blogger made a similar – though more guarded – statement: “By far, the session that was most anticipated was the one in which T. D. Jakes was asked to clarify his position on the Trinity. Thankfully, he did so – though perhaps not in a way that would satisfy all of his critics. I believe we should celebrate his affirmation of the truth that there is one God in three Persons.”

The problem with doing so: Jakes own words on the Holy Trinity in the past and present. Now, here is a link to the transcript of the Elephant Room session, judge Jakes for yourself. But what follows is MY evaluation.

Part 1: I used to follow T.D. Jakes. Now … not so much. Without calling him a liar (while actually, you know, calling him a liar) allow me to propose that just because Jakes says something does not make it so. So … just because Jakes says that he believes “One God three Persons” DOES NOT MEAN that we should take it at face value. Jakes has been “less than forthcoming” on many issues in the past, so he does not deserve the benefit of the doubt. Just because Jakes is in the pulpit and calls himself a Christian does not mean that we should believe what he says. So no, listening to what he says and being “satisfied” requires a presumption that he is telling the truth, a presumption that he does not merit. Does that sound harsh, the bitter words of someone who has “church hurt” as it is called? Well keep reading.

Now in one context I can be SYMPATHETIC to Jakes’ views because I don’t like the wording or terminology used by the Cappadocian fathers myself. But this unease with the Cappadocian formulation needs to be addressed by someone other than Jakes. Why? Because Jakes has been known to be less than honest with the truth, and not merely on this issue. Recall that when Jakes was first challenged on the Trinity doctrine by Christianity Today, he submitted a modalist doctrinal statement that he insisted be accepted as Trinitarian!

Do not take my word on this: another ministry came to the same conclusion, that Jakes was dishonestly trying to pass off modalist heresy for orthodoxy. When challenged on it, he dissembled, claiming that his views on the Trinity were adapting and growing, that he was studying and learning more about it, and how Christians need to stop all this infighting and arguing about such things as minor differences in phraseology and get to the weightier matters of the kingdom, and such excuses for retaining and defending heresy as “these things are too mysterious to be comprehended or explained.” Jakes even resorted to race-baiting, stating “Christians will never agree on every theological issue any more than the colors of our skin will all suddenly match.” So, if Jakes was a liar and a demagogue on this Trinity issue in the past,why should we presume that he is any different now? What has changed to make us presume that Jakes has changed? Especially since he is still preaching heresies in other areas, such as the prosperity doctrine and trying to pass off ecstatic babbling done by mystics in many false religions as “speaking in tongues”?

Part II: From the transcript, it really does appear as if Jakes is fine with “persons” in his Trinitarian statement so long as “persons” is synonymous with “manifestations.” Basically, he says, “well, so long as I can call a ‘person’ a ‘manifestation’ then I am Trinitarian.” He says “My doctrinal statement is no different from yours except the word” – and Driscoll finishes his thought – “manifestations.” What he says next is a amazing.

“Manifest instead of persons. Which you describe as modalist, but I describe it as Pauline. When I read…let me show you what I’m talking about…when I read I Timothy 3:16 – I didn’t create this, Paul did.” And then he goes onto the time-honored modalist lying techniques from the pit of hell: “I think it’s important that we realize that our God is beyond our intellect. And if you can define Him and completely describe Him and say you are the end-all definition of who God is, then He ceases to be God. Because the reason Paul says it is a mystery, is that we deify the fact that God does things that don’t fit our formulas. And because people’s formulas and understandings of a description of an unbiblical God did doesn’t make them demonic.”

Let us go to his abuse of I Timothy 3:16. Yes, the King James Version that many oneness pentecostal liars claim is the only translation – and I used to be KJV-Only myself, and still today am KJV-Preferred, but not because of the translation itself but the texts used to produce the translation, as I believe text criticism used to produce the new manuscripts is a false science – reads “manifest” as its rendering of the Greek word  phaneroō. But other versions translate phaneroō to be “appeared” and “revealed!”

Another thing: phaneroō’s definitions: “to make manifest or visible or known what has been hidden or unknown, to manifest, whether by words, or deeds, or in any other way.”  So, rather than being a “mode” or “state” or “relationship” after the doctrines of the oneness heretics (for example, as water has a liquid, solid and gas manifestation as water, ice and vapor) phaneroō’ in this context merely meant how God was shown to men! That is revelation, after the same manner that the Greek word apokalypsis was used in Revelation 1:1. Paul could have just as easily used apokalypsis instead of phaneroō!

Further, according to the definition, what can phaneroō “reveal” or “manifest”? A PERSON! It is right here in definition 1d in a common Bible lexicon placed online via

1) to make manifest or visible or known what has been hidden or unknown, to manifest, whether by words, or deeds, or in any other way

a) make actual and visible, realised

b) to make known by teaching

c) to become manifest, be made known

d) of a person

1) expose to view, make manifest, to show one’s self, appear

e) to become known, to be plainly recognised, thoroughly understood

1) who and what one is

Jakes is exposed as a liar by exegesis of the very text that he used to claim that he was telling the truth! In this Jakes fulfilled the prophecy in Psalm 10:2, which reads “The wicked in [his] pride doth persecute the poor: let them be taken in the devices that they have imagined.”

Now the dictionary entry makes the Cappadocian utilization of “Person” more justifiable in my mind and it who knows, the Cappadocian fathers might have relied heavily on 1 Timothy 3:16 when they formulated their Trinity doctrine (which would make Jakes’ abuse of that text still more ironic) because that text refers to the revelation of the Person of Jesus Christ and not the mere exhibition of a mode of existence or relationship (and moreover this revelation refers to Christ’s existence being shown to the world; for phaneroō to have the meaning that Jakes claims that it does, THE TERM WOULD HAVE TO REFER TO HIS INCARNATION IN THE WOMB OF MARY, NOT HIS EXISTENCE AND WORKS BEING WITNESSED BY MEN, WHICH IS THE TRUE CONTEXT OF 1 Peter 3:16 AS WELL AS REVELATION 1:1, WHICH AGAIN IS WHY APOKALYPSIS COULD EASILY HAVE BEEN USED INSTEAD) but I confess to still uneasy with it. But the difference between me and Jakes is that JAKES IS LYING. That is the bottom line.

But you know what? This is not truly about Jakes anyway. The reason is that anyone who goes and clicks on the T.D. Jakes category on this blog will know why no legitimate Christian pastor should touch Jakes with a 10 foot pole, unless that pastor has been instructed by God to smite Jakes with it. Instead, it is about the people that are embracing him. It is one thing for the decadent TBN (who has their own tag) Pentecostal abomination to embrace Jakes, and please recall that it was TBN who made Jakes into an international figure. TBN is run by a man who paid off a TBN employee with whom he had a homosexual encounter with, and has since been sued by another man making the same charges. These charges and the many other scandals are commonly known by those who patronize that network anyway and … well now you see why I felt that there were better uses of my time than exposing people who have already been exposed because people simply do not care!

But now, TD Jakes is being embraced by the “more respectable” corners of evangelical Christianity as represented by (ironically named) The Gospel Coalition, which includes some of the most prominent pastors and theologians in evangelical Christianity today. Now of course, there was significant “debate” over inviting Jakes. The fears of those objecting were quite founded, as it resulted in Mark Driscoll, himself a very troubling personality, doing very much to rehabilitate Jakes, largely because of Driscoll’s own desire to push his false anti-cessationist doctrines into the Reformed/Calvinistic evangelical movement. Also, those who would have challenged Jakes rather than accommodate him were not allowed to participate.  But the fact that there was even a debate at all shows how far gone the evangelical landscape is! Having Jakes in the Elephant Room should have been as much a nonstarter as having Richard Dawkins or Pope Benedict!

And that brings us to the real issue: further evidence that the evangelical church in America is veering off the rails. (It is such times that even people who MILDLY stand against Jakes and his lies are the ones to be mocked, opposed and condemned.) Is the great apostasy, the great falling away of 2 Thessalonians 2:3 upon us? This event is prophesied in scripture, and will come to pass. It is a very tragic development in and of itself, but 2 Thess 2:3 tells us that the great falling away is a precursor to – or more accurately a precondition for – the coming of the beast, the anti-Christ, the man of sin, which occurs during the great tribulation. It is my position that the church will experience this great tribulation, and not be raptured from or otherwise escape it, as many pastors and teachers propose. So as difficult as things are now for the church as evidenced by its willingness to not only suffer but endorse and promote such false teachers as Jakes, it is only paving the way for even tougher times to come. Christian, watch and discern the times. Pray. Be strengthened and encouraged in the Lord so that you will not be deceived, that you will resist temptation, and stay in the faith.

For those of you not in the faith, realize that the proliferation of false doctrines and those who gain wealth, fame and power by teaching them does not undermine Christianity, but rather is evidence that the Bible is true, for Jesus Christ Himself and His apostles predicted that such a time as this would come thousands of years ago; Christ referred to men such as Jakes as ravening wolves in sheep’s clothing. That many will follow such people is evidence that narrow is the gate that leads to salvation, and wide is that which leads to destruction!

Enter into the narrow gate. Be saved in the Name of Jesus Christ. Repent of your sins, believe in Jesus Christ. Follow

The Three Step Salvation Plan

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Posted in Bible, Christianity, false doctrine, false religion, false teaching, Jesus Christ | Tagged: , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , | 5 Comments »

Regarding The Online Discernment Ministries

Posted by Job on March 21, 2009

Hello Fellow Laborers In Jesus Christ:

A lot of you may have noticed that I have gotten extremely slack in making new posts, approving comments, and responding to emails these past months. I am extremely sorry, and wish you to know that there are two reasons for this. The first is that for the past several months, I have been dealing with a number of personal, family, and financial challenges and changes that, while not posing real problems for myself and my family (quite the contrary, God has been very good to my family and I in ways that you cannot imagine!) have placed great demands on my time, so much so that I have actually considered ending this site, or at the very least placing it on long term hiatus, as it does look like these issues are going to persist for the time being. 

Now that is the main reason, but there are others. Even though I have not been actively working on Jesus Christology for some time, it has been often on my mind and in my prayers, as have been the many people that have participated in its discussions. Ironically, the time that I have been forced to spend away from Jesus Christology has given me the opportunity to pray and reflect on precisely what I have been doing since I went online in February 2007 (initially by importing content created for my prior Heal The Land website – which, incidentally, has been unfairly taken offline by the Bravehost people) and have wondered about my actions and their effectiveness. I must be honest, I have always intended to honor and promote Jesus Christ with my work, but good intentions are not enough. God commands to be served the way God desires to be served, not the way that man chooses to serve Him. So when I consider the doctrines that I have promoted that I no longer subscribe to; the pastors and ministries that I promoted that I can no longer in good conscience support, and in particular the angry, confrontational, at times self – flagellating posture that I maintained for the first year or so, my conclusion is that while it probably made for entertaining reading and discussions, but what good did it do, really? How did it uplift Jesus Christ? 

I am going to deal specifically with the fact that a great deal of my content came directly from various online discernment ministries, and that I actually made Jesus Christology (and its predecessor, Heal The Land With Spiritual Warfare) a “part time” online discernment ministry. Now online discernment ministries do great work and have their place. As a matter of fact, I am deeply indebted to a particular online discernment ministry for planting the seed that caused me to abandon the false prosperity doctrine/Word of Faith movements, and Christians do need to be at work warning people and defending the faith against wolves in sheep’s clothing moving about the church.

However, I was very disturbed to find out that the very online discernment ministry that led me to the tip of the iceberg of spiritual corruption with one of their posts had taken up the practice of denouncing Christian pastors that choose to affiliate themselves with Barack HUSSEIN Obama. Now of course, no Christian pastor should have anything to do with this Obama person, this online discernment ministry made an excellent Biblical case why, so that wasn’t the problem. The problem is that in the years that I have frequented this ministry, before I even went up with Jesus Christology/Heal The Land With Spiritual Warfare, I have never ONCE seen them criticize a single of the many pastors for affiliating themselves with and supporting the wickedness of George W. Bush, Ronald Reagan, John McCain and similar. If these people cannot “discern” (or more likely refuse to be honest enough to acknowledge) the wickedness of the bunch on the “conservative” side of the ideological and political aisle merely by viewing their deeds and who they associate with and hold the religious right to the same standards as everybody else, what gives them the right, the spiritual standing and authority, to stand in judgment of anybody else? Is it not far better to serve the Lord ins simple submission and silence?

I am not merely tilting at windmills here, but I am going by the example that was set by who can be considered (my me at least!) the forerunner of the modern discernment minister, one Charles Spurgeon. While Spurgeon was pastoring in England, the Protestant church there was on its rapid and determined path into liberal apostasy, and Spurgeon saw it happening. Yet Spurgeon held his tongue and pen for years, waiting to address the issue at the right time and in the appropriate manner. But when Spurgeon finally did act, it was in a wise, reasoned, measured, prudent, truthful, and Biblical manner by addressing what he called “the Down – Grade controversy” in a series of sermons, and also in his publication The Sword and the Trowel. Now of course, Spurgeon’s actions were very controversial, and he was hit with many of the same accusations that dog the various discernment ministries today. Yet Spurgeon was much less impeachable, much more defensible, than the modern efforts because his manner of dealing with the apostates and heretics of his time was much more reasoned, mature, responsible, and ultimately Biblical. How ironic, then, that Spurgeon is a favorite of the very online discernment ministry that I am speaking of. 

What we can perhaps learn from Spurgeon’s example is how the fight for faith, how the contending for the faith once delivered to the saints, how giving a defense/apology for the faith will be done. In short, it should be done facing the simple reality that most people aren’t going to listen. The words are going to fall on hard hearts and deaf ears because those who possess these hearts and ears are not born again Christians, but sinners. We know from the clear witness of the Bible and of history that from the time of Old Testament Israel in the past until the time that Jesus Christ returns in the future, most of the people that have referred to themselves as the children of YHWH are only so in name only, which means that they are not in truth.

As a result, they have no true interest in spiritual things, in sound doctrine and in obedience to the commandments of Jesus Christ as expressed in the Bible. Instead, their only interest is being considered righteous according to the standards of the Christian mainstream, which is determined by viewing Christianity in the context of what has been deemed acceptable for Christians by the larger culture. Whether you are a predestinarian who believes that the reason for this is that these people have not been elected (which is my current position) or a free will Christian who believe that these people have rejected Jesus Christ (which was my previous position) the end result is the same. 

So no matter how often we talk about Rick Warren, Pat Robertson, Todd Bentley, T.D. Jakes, Paula White, Paul Crouch, Billy Graham, Robert Schuller, Tim LaHaye, James Dobson, ecumenism with Roman Catholics, the emergent church etc. it isn’t going to change hearts. The only thing that will change hearts is the gospel, the message of Jesus Christ and Him crucified and raised from the dead. Of course, heresies and heretics should be discussed, for they certainly are discussed in the Bible, and of course we should use these examples and others to guide people away from the many false gospels to the one true gospel of the hard road that leads to the strait gate. But it should be done as part of the full gospel message, taking its appropriate place in bringing sinners to faith in Jesus Christ and equipping those who already believe to walk in the faith of Jesus Christ. If it is done for any other reason and in any other context, then it is just a tinkling cymbal of 1 Corinthians 13, at best the work of someone sincere but unbalanced and misguided and at worst something that is just as capable of being a source of error.

Above all, we honestly do need to know our place. We need to act in faith; to trust God. We must stop trying to help God out, to do His job for Him. Instead, we must out of faith and submission stand back and allow God the Son and God the Holy Spirit to do the job of building the church and defending it. In the course of doing so, we will not be hindered or distracted from doing our own jobs by trying to do the job that only God can do.

In closing, allow me to mention that one movie that I love is the Jesus Christ movie that I acquired for my kids, “The Miracle Maker.” (I don’t love the fact that this movie’s rights are owned by Mel Gibson’s production company, but as I have not discovered anything ascriptural in it, it remains in my possession, unlike the completely anti-scriptural “The Passion of the Christ”, which I do not own and never will.) In it, the movie contains a simple explanation of Christ’s commandment to “build your house on the rock” by telling us “take the hard way, not the easy way.” Presenting the full, true, gospel through the Christ – centered exegesis, exposition, and application of scripture is extremely hard. Talking about the lies that Kenneth Copeland said last week, is saying this week, and unless he repents will say next week is comparatively easy. I propose that in order to be a true online discernment ministry, it has to be built upon the rock and do the hard work as described in 2 Timothy 4:5

But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry.

Thank you.

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