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A Question For Premillennial Dispensational Rapture Believers: Explain The Fifth Seal In Revelation!

Posted by Job on September 25, 2009

Revelation 6:9-11 reads

And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held: And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth? And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

The Word of God for the elect people of God. Glory be to God.

For my premillennial dispensational brethren who believe in a pretribulation (or prewrath) rapture that spares the church from the time of sorrow, please explain this text. Who are those slain for the Word of God? Are they Christians? And when will these Christians be slain for their testimony? Does it refer to those believers slain in times past, whether in the Old Testament or at the time that Revelation was written? Or does it refer to believers slain during the great tribulation? (If so, how can any Christian stand under persecution, even martyrdom, without being emboldened by the Holy Spirit, which according to premillennial dispensational doctrine has to be taken from the earth along with the church? Please recall the difference between Peter and the apostles before the Comforter – cowering and fearful and running from their lives – and afterwards – bold and brave witnesses even unto death. As a matter of fact Peter himself went from being the worst – the one who denied Christ three times – to being the boldest. And how can anyone even be saved during the great tribulation without the work of the Holy Spirit? Recall: the Holy Spirit was indeed present during the time of the Old Testament saints. Indeed, the Bible states that the earth’s very existence cannot so much as even be sustained without the Spirit of God.) Or does it refer to believers slain during all ages, from the first (Abel) until the last before the return of Jesus Christ?

To interpret this passage with scripture, let us go to another one in Revelation that touches the martyrdom of the saints, which is Revelation 18:24. Please recall that this chapter refers to the fall of Babylon,  which since the Tower of Babel incident and particularly since the destruction of the temple in 586 has been used to symbolize people and systems that rebel against and oppose God and persecute His elect covenant people, and that Revelation extends this symbolism with personification, describing all that opposes God as a harlot (prostitute), which in this verse is called “her”:  And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth. Now as much as I love my King James Version, allow me to quibble with their translation of “kai” to “and” in the phrase “and of all that were slain upon the earth.” Many times, “kai” is just used for emphasis, as an amplifier of degree or a focus of attention. This text should probably read:

“And in her [Babylon] was found the blood of prophets and of saints, indeed all [prophets and saints] that were slain upon the earth.”

However, if you go with the King James Version, which granted carries much more weight and authority than my own, and all which follow its tradition on that text, then “and of all that were slain upon the earth” simply means that in Babylon was the blood of every person that has been murdered, all innocent blood that has been shed. This means that the prior clause “And in her was found the blood of prophets and of saints” means that “the prophets and saints” (a  New Testament idiom which refers to old covenant and new covenant believers) which means that the blood of Stephen and all other Christian martyrs ever since is contained in Babylon. So with reference to the elect the meaning is the same: the blood of everyone killed because of their faith in God is in Babylon.

So, if we interpret Revelation 6:9-11 with Revelation 18:24, when the fifth seal was opened the martyred souls viewed under the altar should very likely be interpreted to include every Christian martyr since Stephen. This would support the idea of a church that has always been under continuous tribulation. Such an interpretation would be consistent with, indeed fulfill the words of Jesus Christ in John 15:18-20.

If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you. If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you. Remember the word that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also. But all these things will they do unto you for my name’s sake, because they know not him that sent me.

The Word of God for the people of God. Glory be to God.

Now one can hardly claim that those words were only aimed at the apostles. Those words are for all Christians for all time. So what basis is there for believing that there will be a rapture to save the church from a persecution that A) Jesus Christ said that we would face and B) Jesus Christ sent the Holy Spirit to empower us to withstand? Now this is not an endorsement of the historicist, preterist or amillennial position that there will be no seven year literal great tribulation. Instead, it is to say that if there will be such a seven year literal great tribulation, the church will be present for it just as it has been present for all other tribulations, the “lesser” tribulations.

Now the prewrath (and mid-wrath) rapture adherent does have Revelation 3:10, which reads “Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth”, in his favor. However, that could be fulfilled in a number of ways, including 1) a place of refuge (which ironically rapture believers commonly propose will exist for those who will saved during the great tribulation … again these people will have to be saved despite the absence of a church to preach the gospel or a Holy Spirit to perform regeneration) or 2) death. Do not let the “death” option astonish you, but instead study the scriptures, especially the Old Testament but also in the New Testament. It is a consistent theme that death is a way of being preserved, saved, spared from times of great evil … to be absent from the troubles of this world and present with God! Perhaps the best example of this is the death of Abijah, son of the wicked king Jeroboam, who died according to God’s will so that he would not be corrupted by Jeroboam and also not share in their judgment in 1 Kings 14. A New Testament example: at the time that he wrote Philippians 1:20-26, Paul viewed death as being removed from the extremely trying circumstances that he was living and exchanging it for a better fate. In that passage Paul stated “to die is gain”, but it appears that the rapture adherents have transformed it into “to be raptured is gain.”

So, the idea that there must be a rapture in order for Christians to be spared martyrdom seems to be inconsistent with Biblical revelation. It is also an idea that only makes sense for Christians living in the west. Practically everywhere else in the world, Christians face persecution: marginalization, poverty, disease, imprisonment, death. There are two doctrinal systems that have the effect of promoting the idea western Christians should have no part in what Christians in Indonesia, China, Iran, Palestine (and Israel!), India and Mexico (where Roman Catholic/pagan syncretists are persecuting Protestants) by simple right of geography of birth: pretribulation rapture and covenant theology. Pretribulation rapture teaches that Christians not currently under persecution now will never have to face it, because persecution will only come to “the good parts of the world” (i.e. “Christian nations” or “western nations” or “non-socialist nations” … you know, what Glenn Beck was referring to) when the anti-Christ (which 8% of New Jersey residents regard Obama to be) takes over it.

Now ask yourselves … why is it that Christians can be persecuted in some places (including Israel … and read this too!) now without the anti-Christ, but it requires the anti-Christ to happen in others (especially America)? Or that the saints in other places (and times, including in the west … remember the 30 Years War and the Anabaptists?) are not spared persecution, but only the modern American saints are? Only the idea that contemporary western (especially American and possibly British!) Christians are somehow better than Christians living in other times and places, and this fact would be due to America having some special status before God as a unique elect covenant nation, giving us special status within the Body of Christ. Of course, the Bible makes it clear in the Roman and Corinthian epistles that there is no special group or people with a special status, special favor, or special standing before God in the Body of Christ, but instead that we are one Body. Further, the Bible makes it clear that those who are accounted greater according to rank or authority (not standing or value) demonstrate this through being servant roles that cause us to A) serve those who are of lesser rank and authority and B) endure even greater persecution than those who are of lesser rank and authority. So, even if America did have some special standing before God, instead of our being wealthy decadent privileged Laodiceans, we would be poor, oppressed and serving everybody else! If you deny this, read the Beatitudes of Jesus Christ!

Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. (Keep in mind, the version in Luke reads “Blessed are the POOR!”)
Blessed are they that mourn: for they shall be comforted.
Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.
Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled.
Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy.
Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.
Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God.
Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness’ sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.
Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you.

The Word of God for the people of God. Glory be to God.

Now earlier I mentioned the covenant theologians, from whom the modern concept of the “Christian nation” originated. Covenant theologians believe – or at least believed – that people in “Christian nations” would or should be spared persecution only because in a church-state Christians would control the government, economy, military, police, and religion in a theocracy after the manner of Old Testament Israel. That is why such extreme theonomists and reconstructionists as Gary North and Rousas John (R. J.) Rushdoony deny that the Beatitudes and the Sermon on the Mount apply to Christians, instead stating that it only applied to Jews living in that time. (Curiously, hyperdispensationalists believe the same.) While I believe the covenant theology position to be in error, this statement is aimed primarily at premillennnial dispensationalists.

So if America were this special, Christian nation, it would be marked by our poverty and service, not by our decadent delusions of religious nobility which makes us believe that we are somehow exempt from the sufferings of Christians living in Belarus or Namibia, or for that matter the Christians of the early church. After all, when Paul wrote his statement insisting that those in the Body of Christ were equals, the statements were direct AGAINST two groups of people: the Jewish Christians in the Roman church and the wealthy Christians in the Corinthian church. The Jewish Christians regarded themselves to be superior to the Gentile Christians because of nationality, and the wealthy Corinthian Christians regarded themselves as superior to the poorer believers because of their riches. The Holy Spirit inspired Paul to tell both groups that they were wrong. So, then, how can we justify believing that a rapture will come and rescue us from the type of persecutions and deaths at the hands of Muslims that are going on all over the Middle East, Asia and Africa right now, such as the two million Christians that were killed in Sudan, many of whom were tortured, raped, doused with gasoline and set on fire, had their limbs chopped off, or were sold as slaves because they refused to renounce Christianity?

Ironically, the world, including the media, the activists, and the government of our own “Christian nation”, did their level best to ignore this genocide, choosing instead to focus on Muslims murdering other Muslims in Darfur. And let us not forget that the term for which the word genocide was originally invented and applied to, that of the Armenians by the Turks, is still not recognized as such by the U.N. or by the government of our “Christian nation.” It is still more ironic when you consider that the Armenian genocide happened in the same general area that the letters in Revelation were sent, in the Turkey region. That persecution kicked off what was the bloodiest period of Christian persecution in history, the 20th century, that saw 45.5 million Christians killed!

So if there were any geographical or political entity within the Body of Christ that had special status, it would be those Christians because of their poverty and persecution who would come first, not us . It is those to whom the Beatitudes of Jesus Christ were addressed, and premillennial dispensationalism completely rejects that truth for the belief that the rapture will save Christians not yet under persecution from ever having to experience it because the saints who have it easier are the ones who fulfill Revelation 3:10! Never mind that the rich church that was not facing persecution was Laodicea, and the church that Revelation 3:10 was addressed to was Philadelphia. Why was the promise of Revelation 3:10 given to the Philadelphians? It is in Revelation 3:8, which reads “I know thy works: behold, I have set before thee an open door, and no man can shut it: for thou hast a little strength, and hast kept my word, and hast not denied my name.” The Philadelphia Christians were being persecuted, and similar to the Sudanese Christians, they refused to yield to the persecution by denying Jesus Christ. In other words, they refused to do the same as the apostle Peter did THREE TIMES before he was empowered by the Holy Spirit, yet dispensationalism teaches that this Holy Spirit will be taken away, and those converted during the great tribulation will have to face the greatest time of sorrows ever without it, and will yet somehow stand? How? Why? Because of their free will? Or because of their inherently good human nature untainted by original sin? Followers of Reformed/Calvinist believers in the rapture like John MacArthur and Albert Pendarvis (the latter’s bookstore sells the Scofield Reference Bible) have to answer these questions! In any event, those who claim that Revelation 3:10 refers to Christians being raptured to escape persecution have to deal with the fact that the text was in reference to a Philadelphia church that was enduring it!

Make no mistake. I believe in a bodily literal return of Jesus Christ which I believe will occur after a literal great tribulation which will include a literal and personal anti-Christ. However, I also believe that the church will endure this tribulation, and that we need to be preparing ourselves and those who will follow us in the faith for it in a manner that is consistent with scripture as opposed to believing that we – or our WESTERN descendants – will have an experience of escaping it that will be unique to Christians living in other times and places. At the very least, someone must explain why western Christians alone should enjoy this pleasure!

The Three Step Salvation Plan

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Practical Theology: I Am Too Fat To Survive The Great Tribulation!

Posted by Job on September 17, 2009

Recently I abandoned my belief in the secret rapture, instead taking the view that the church will be present for the seven years of great tribulation. My belief is that such will be a very difficult time of the church similar to that of Israel (or more specifically Judah) during the time of Jeremiah. Christians will be in constant physical danger, often having to relocate or flee, and providing for even the bare necessities of life (food, clothing, shelter) will be difficult. We will have to rely totally on God to supply all our needs instead of any country, government, economic system etc. Instead, the nations, governments, militaries, political and economic systems etc. will be united against us. It will be completely the opposite of the easy, decadent living that western Christians have known and enjoyed for hundreds of years … the very same which many Christians are apparently willing to torture and kill other people in order to preserve.

And I regret to say that if these horrible difficult times for the church were to occur any time soon, I have no idea how I would stand a chance! I would be one of the very first to be captured trying to run away! Why? Because like a heavily disproportionate number of evangelical or fundamentalist Christians from the deep south, my health is in terrible shape. Now a few short years ago God miraculously preserved my health by instantly healing my worsening asthma as well as damage to my kidneys caused by my longtime overuse of over the counter asthma medicine. But this is the thing: the need to manage my asthma was my primary motivation for at least trying to keep my weight down. With that sole restraint out of the way, I have now ballooned to about 75 pounds more than I was when I was unloading trucks for a living!

For the longest, I have been deluding myself as to the true seriousness of my physical condition, brought on by the sins of gluttony and sloth (as well as my love for red meat, eggs, cheese, and soft drinks!) but now my eyes are opened. It happened just recently, as my frustration with the messages in my children’s television shows reached the tipping point (specifically the homosexual pagan lemur character in “Penguins of Madagascar” … the person who originally did the voice for this character in the movie versions was Jesus Christ hating Sacha Baron Cohen of the movie “Bruno” … need I say more?) and I decided that the entertainment for my children was going to (as much as possible) be “the great outdoors” as opposed to Nickelodeon, Cartoon Network, and Disney. Hiking, fishing, exploring … I was even considering challenging my long-held aversion to (fear of!) camping and swimming. And no, I am not ashamed to acknowledge that the idea that Christians JUST MAY NEED SURVIVAL SKILLS motivated me just a little.

Then I was confronted with cold, hard reality. My very first trip to a local park with this nice little mountain trail, made very easy and accessible for THE ELDERLY left me huffing, puffing and sweating (but thank God no wheezing or any other asthma symptoms whatsoever … again the asthma is gone praise be to Jesus Christ, and no I didn’t “grow out of it” but it was the worst that it had ever been right up to the home prayer session that me and my family had!) after 20 minutes. My kids and I had gone MAYBE a quarter of a mile. They were having a great time looking at birds, trees, and the mountain (which is actually a hill, but don’t tell the locals that!) but they had to leave because their old man couldn’t keep up with them! Now I continued lying to myself, thinking “this is nothing that a few trips on the treadmill won’t fix” while driving myself to yet another fast food restaurant. But the very next trip, to a park with a small waterfall, their excellent time was cut short by my physical limitations. So, three thoughts popped into my head.

A) I was actually in much better shape when I had asthma. Even if I did have to take a few puffs of my inhaler from time to time, I was actually capable of walking all day. Now, I can barely walk for 30 minutes! For my to practically reject God’s gracious and merciful healing of my body by allowing myself to get in such poor physical condition that I cannot realize the benefits of the blessing is a terrible commentary on my spiritual (not physical but spiritual!) condition. I recall the man that Jesus Christ healed to whom Christ said “stop sinning or else something worse will come upon you.” Well, anyone needing evidence that gluttony (both eating too much and eating the wrong things) and sloth are sins only need to look at my person, for again I am actually in worse condition than I was when I had asthma. Paul Washer regularly mentions how so many Christians are killing themselves with our eating and exercise habits, and it appears that he was talking directly to me!
B) I was thinking “wow, if U.N. secretary general/global leader were to give the ’round up all Bible believing Christians’ order, I wouldn’t even be able to grab my kids and make it to the car, let alone run up the side of some mountain!” Begging the indulgence of all amillennialists and preterists, remember Matthew 24 when Jesus Christ said “escape to the mountains!” when the time of sorrows comes? I am too fat and out of shape to comply with that commandment!
C) Also, without even needing some endtimes scenario, I realized that it would have merely taken our being pursued by some desperate criminal or some rabid raccoon (or any emergency which would have required my grabbing my children and carrying them while outrunning something or someone somewhere) to expose how reckless and irresponsible I have been with my health and in this way would not be able to fulfill the physical requirements of being the steward, the head of my family as the Bible requires.

And yes, I also recall having read this book on evangelism whose author stated that overweight evangelists, missionaries, pastors etc. are often not taken seriously, especially in areas of the country and world where physical fitness, by the people that they are attempting to minister to. So, I am immediately going to start incorporating diet and exercise as part of my personal approach to Christian living. If nothing else, it would exhibit wisdom and self-control, and against such things there is no law!

P.S. No, this is not an endorsement of the “health” portion of the prosperity doctrine. Nor do I endorse the increasingly common practice of churches calling themselves “family life” or “whole person” centers and building fitness centers and doing things like offering dance aerobics (to gospel music of course!). Just as 1 Corinthians 11:34 says “if any man hunger, let him eat at home; that ye come not together unto condemnation” then it follows that we should do our EXERCISING at home (or at least at someplace other than church!) also. After all, if going to go to church to lose weight, who is going to evangelize the overweight people that go to the gyms?

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ARE ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION ENFORCEMENT TACTICS MERELY GOVERNMENT TRAINING FOR GREAT TRIBULATION TACTICS TO BE USED AGAINST CHRISTIANS?

Posted by Job on May 30, 2008

I want to make two things clear. 

1. I oppose illegal immigration. Why? Because it is illegal. Now if it weren’t illegal, I would still be no great fan of it, but I would not pay much attention to it because of more pressing matters i.e. abortion genocide and false Christian preachers, both of which by the way are perfectly legal. As it is, government and big business colluding to aid and abet wide scale criminality for their mutual benefit but to the detriment of citizens, workers, and consumers illustrates that the notion of “rule of law” does not exist in this country. Instead, this nation is being ruled by bandits, thugs, and criminals in three piece suits from Wall Street to Capitol Hill to the White House. 

2. After leaving behind the “Left Behind” Cyrus Scofield Roman Catholic Jesuit rapture cult, I was forced to acknowledge that the doctrine of the imminent return of Jesus Christ must be interpreted in an eschatological sense rather than a temporal one – and such would have to be the case or else the last few verses of Revelation would have been demonstrated to be false like 1900 years ago – and as a result the great tribulation could just as easily come 500 years from now as tomorrow. I have to tell you … knowing to interpret Revelation in an eschatological – while still fully literal! – sense would have saved me a lot of hours watching John Hagee during his “Jerusalem Countdown” period a few years back, and it would have also saved a lot of Christians from being taken in by things like “recently discovered Bible codes prove that Jesus Christ will return in the year 2000!” hysteria. Look, Christians have to be honest enough to acknowledge that according to the very same method of Bible interpretation methods used by the “Left Behind” crowd, the rapture should have occurred at or around 70 AD. 

With those two lengthy qualifying statements out of the way, the article Operation Return to Sender on the techniques used to find and deport illegal immigrants by the Bureau of Immigration and Customs Enforcement ought to really get Christians to thinking. First, you have ICE inflicting “detailing stomach-turning—and sometimes deadly—mistreatment in immigrant detention centers.” Second, “Operation Return to Sender” targets immigrants that the courts have already told to leave the country. Problem ? The government freely acknowledges “about half of the information in ICE’s “Deportable Alien Control System”—a database of immigrants to be deported—is incorrect or incomplete.” (It makes me wonder if Jeb Bush’s faulty list of people ineligible to vote because of felony convictions – a list compiled by a corporation – during the election 2000 recount fiasco was nothing but a trial run). 

Still more. “… enforcement teams carry out large-scale sweeps, raiding homes in neighborhoods with a lot of immigrants just after sunrise. Without an accurate list of which homes actually harbor undocumented immigrants, agents often rely on race to figure out who’s here legally and who isn’t. For example, in Fair Haven, Conn., several residents reported that during a raid last summer, ICE officers went door to door asking how many people were inside each house—and what race they were. In an ICE operation in Willmar, Minn., Latino residents were handcuffed and interrogated while white residents, some even in the same home, went unquestioned.” NEOCONSERVATIVES who support racial profiling have no problem with this? Fine. But in great tribulation year 5 when they will be going house to house looking for Christians instead of Mexicans, let us see how many of you will still be neoconservative. (Yes, my going from Bush Republican to basically libertarian did coincide with my leaving the rapture cult.) I should point out that going house to house looking for all the Christians to arrest has already happened to Christians in various nations at various times throughout history. After all, how do you think that governments in China, North Korea, and in various Muslim nations locate and break up these cells of illegal Christian house churches? Go to http://persecution.org or http://persecution.com to see what I am talking about. But so long as it is not happening IN THIS COUNTRY RIGHT NOW makes this tactic OK, right? 

It gets better. “By ICE’s own admission, the bureau has mistakenly detained, arrested, and even deported not only legal immigrants but also U.S. citizens. Those caught up in recent home raids include Adriana Aguilar, a citizen living in East Hampton, N.Y., who was sound asleep with her 4-year-old son when ICE officers stormed into her bedroom, pulled the covers off the bed, and shined flashlights into her face before interrogating her. In San Rafael, Calif., ICE detained 6-year-old Kebin Reyes, a citizen from birth, holding him in a locked office for 12 hours after immigration agents, pretending to be police, stormed into the apartment he shared with his father and forcibly removed him from his home.” I can see the government deciding that it is best to take children from Christian parents in operations like this, can’t you? First, consider the Mormon raid in Texas, which I threw up a post endorsing, now ruled illegal. Second, consider that being a “fundamentalist” Christian is now a factor in divorce proceedings used to determine who gets primary or sole custody of children. 

This is the best part. “The government’s guidelines for immigration enforcement prohibit these kinds of abuses. Why aren’t they being enforced? Theories abound. ICE attorneys have suggested that because most of the rules governing officer conduct were instituted before the Department of Homeland Security took over immigration enforcement, they don’t apply to ICE at all. Another explanation is that in the wake of Sept. 11, stepped-up immigration enforcement may have taken priority over careful procedures.” So, once Christians are declared to be clear and present dangers due to our divisive, dangerous, and extremist rhetoric on the Bible being infallible and the final authority and Jesus Christ being the only way to heaven (please note that evangelical favorite George W. Bush has openly rejected both, while Billy Graham openly denied the first decades ago by embracing Roman Catholicism and the original edition of “The Living Bible” that contained purposeful blatant alterations, and later denied the second as well) and the eternal lake of fire awaits all who reject either, the tactics that are now being used against Muslims and illegal immigrants will be used against Christians. “Waterboarding” and “Rendition” to Christians? Why not?

The big payoff! “Twenty-five years ago, in the case of INS v. Lopez-Mendoza, the Supreme Court declined to extend the Fourth Amendment’s guarantees to immigration proceedings. But Justice Sandra Day O’Connor recognized that if in the future there were “good reason to believe” that constitutional violations in immigration enforcement were “widespread,” the way judges handled these cases would have to change.” Vatican stooge (and illegal immigration supporter) Ronald Reagan put Sandra Day O’Connor on the Supreme Court, which is all you need to know. And how many of Reagan’s policies contributed to the problems that we have in the Middle East right now? Or didn’t you know that the Reagan administration considered Saddam Hussein an ally, providing his regime with training, weapons, and money? It certainly looks like with respect to the war on terror and illegal immigration, the government created these problems only to later claim to need draconian measures to solve them. 

Speaking of the aforementioned Florida 2000, the combination of illegal immigration, the war on terror,  the need to combat voter fraud, the need to track sex offenders, and the need to battle identity theft will result in calls for a system of electronic identification and monitoring in the near future. Will that mean that the great tribulation is upon us? No. The scenarios described in Revelation do not only apply to America, but to the entire world. Some have limited it somewhat by stating that such things as being unable to buy or sell will only apply to the portion of the world that matters in Bible prophecy and the Bible in general. Now I should point out that many other nations of the world are fully onto this agenda. The National Review claims that France has enacted stronger measures in the war on terror that America has … that they will deport a Muslim preacher for delivering a sermon that offends the government in a heartbeat. (And knowing France’s feelings towards Biblical Christians, Christians are supposed to support this WHY?) Many in Europe are also joining the anti – immigrant chorus as well. While I am very sympathetic to these people’s concerns, it bears asking why the governments that comprised the EU decided to A) promote policies that they KNEW would result in extremely low birthrates among the native population while B) having open immigration policies in the first place other than to create chaos that people would support repressive government policies to control. Please recognize that the only reason why the VERY NATIONALISTIC Europeans consented to economic integration – and the political integration that goes with it – was because the member nations had spent decades purposefully wrecking their economies. And of course, once the EU was formed, pretty much the same group of folks that had spent the last few decades wrecking economies all of a sudden returned to sound economic policy resulting in fast economic growth, making Frenchmen who wold have been aghast at being linked with Italians, Spaniards, Germans, and – gasp! – EASTERN EUROPEANS think that giving up their sovereignty, traditions, and cultures is a grand idea. How long before universal healthcare, jobs programs, endless wars, and global warming economic regulations, and $5 a gallon gas (thanks ANWR!) makes our own economy so bad that a North American Union with Mexico and Canada starts looking like a great idea? By the way … Mexico has a ton of oil that its government won’t allow anyone access to …

Actually, that last scenario is a contradiction in my endtimes scenario: if we adopt the North American Union and open the Mexican and Canadian borders, that would lessen the rationale for national ID cards by negating the illegal immigration issue. Then again, if the North American Union is ever formed, the government will have so much power that it will be able to autocratically mandate such IDs – and share the information from it with the EU and any similar body of African, Asian, and Latin American nations – and there won’t be anything that anyone will be able to do about it. 

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John Hagee Says Barack HUSSEIN Obama IS NOT The Anti – Christ!

Posted by Job on April 8, 2008

I happen to agree with apostate heretic Hagee on this one incidentally. Others that I have discussed this with are considering the source (apostate heretic Hagee) and as a result are even more suspicious of Obama than before.

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George Bush Tells Israel To End Occupation: I Voted For Bush The Anti – Christ

Posted by Job on January 10, 2008

You pre – tribulationists know what I am talking about. Video link: US president sets out blueprint for Palestinian state. Says peace treaty will be signed by end of term, specifies ’67 lines must be modified, indicates rejection of Palestinian “right of return.”

MSNBC link to Bush demanding Palestinian state article

MSNBC Video Link to Bush pushing Palestinian state

Jerusalem Post article link to George W. Bush demanding Israeli Knesset keep corrupt incompetent wicked innocent blood on his hands Ehud Olmert in power long enough to sign peace deal.

Anybody ready to run to the city of refuge? Or are you all set to vote for another anti – Christ like Barack HUSSEIN Obama, Hillary Clinton, John Edwards, Ron Paul, Mike Huckabee, Mitt Romney, Fred Thompson, or Rudy Giuliani?

Posted in anti - Christ, Barack Hussein Obama, Barack Obama, beast, Bible, Christianity, endtimes, eschatology, George Bush, GOP, great tribulation, harpagesometha, Hillary Clinton, innocent blood, Israel, Mike Huckabee, Mitt Romney, prophecy, Republican, Ron Paul, Rudy Giuliani | Tagged: , , , , , , , | 7 Comments »

 
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