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Why Does J. Lee Grady Of Charisma Magazine Want To AVOID A Charismatic War?

Posted by Job on July 9, 2008

I am going to quote Grady’s post in full below because it looks like when he puts a new entry up it overlays the previous one.

Some leaders say the controversial Lakeland Revival is forcing us to choose sides. But I don’t believe God wants to split our movement.

It’s been more than 10 years since charismatic prophet Rick Joyner predicted in his popular bookThe Final Quest that believers would experience a Civil War in the church. Joyner’s book, based on a series of visions he says God showed him, describes in graphic detail a turbulent conflict that redefines Christianity as we know it.

Other charismatic leaders have echoed this theme since Joyner’s book was published in 1996. They have predicted that our movement will be divided between “Blues” (those who constantly live in the supernatural realm of dreams, visions and miracles) and “Grays” (those who rely more on their intellect), and that the Blues will win and usher in true revival as champions of the Holy Spirit’s power.
 
Even in early 2008, before the Lakeland Revival erupted in Florida in April, some charismatic prophets were declaring that a great rift would divide those who believe in “the glory realm” and those who have a more conservative, left-brained approach to their faith. When God TV began its nightly broadcasts of evangelist Todd Bentley’s healing meetings in Lakeland, the Civil War prophecies reappeared overnight on hundreds of blogs and e-mail blasts.
“Jesus prayed that we would be one. There is no record of Him praying that we would split over doctrine.”

I’ll admit I was not paying too much attention to these Civil War predictions 10 years ago. But I was jolted into reality in May after I wrote an online column in which I raised honest questions about some of Bentley’s teachings and techniques. Even though I celebrated his passion and zeal, and praised God for the healings that were reported in Lakeland, I was immediately branded a revival critic and banished to the Gray camp.

 I became the bad guy because, by asking questions, I was “relying on my intellect.” To those in the Blue camp, my skepticism made me an enemy of the Holy Spirit and all things supernatural—even though I believe that all the supernatural gifts of the Holy Spirit are for today!
 
I tried to laugh this off at first. Surely, I imagined, my Christian brothers and sisters do not really think it is wrong for a Spirit-filled believer to test the spirits (which we are instructed to do in 1 John 4:1), discern truth (see 2 Pet. 3:17) or evaluate prophecies and angelic encounters (see 1 Cor. 14:29, Gal. 1:6-8).
 
But now I realize that some people really want a war. They want the charismatic movement to split right down the middle. They imply that all those who do not embrace 100 percent of the current movement in Lakeland are “old wineskins” that cannot be used by God in the coming revival.
 
I can’t even describe how much this hurts because I love people on both sides of this conflict. I love the Blues and the Grays, along with every other color in the body of Christ. I refuse to believe that God is trying to split us. Division is the devil’s work.
 
I want to plead with everyone in our movement to reconsider the whole Civil War scenario. Instead of rattling sabers and stockpiling gunpowder, maybe we need to take steps in the opposite direction:
 
1. Let’s accept one another. The apostle Paul rebuked the Corinthians because they exalted certain gifts above others. He reminded them that every member of the body of Christ plays an important role, and that no individual part—whether eye, hand or foot—functions on its own. He rebuked this elitist attitude “so that there may be no division in the body” (1 Cor. 12:25, NASB).
 
Most of us already acknowledge the importance of supernatural gifts of healing, prophecy, tongues and other demonstrations of God’s power. But in our zeal to recover these gifts, let’s not isolate those whose primary functions may be mercy, giving to the poor, teaching or intercession. We should cherish every spiritual gift—not just the sensational or the exotic.
 
2. Let’s admonish one another. Christians have not always been the best models of conflict resolution. When tension gets high we either avoid it (usually by saying nothing and hoping the problems go away) or we overreact (by childishly picking up our marbles and playing somewhere else). But the Bible tells us to work things out in eyeball-to-eyeball confrontation.
 
In the case of Lakeland, there are some doctrines and methods that have come under intense scrutiny. Heresy hunters are having a field day as they toss their grenades and label everything in Lakeland demonic. But because I embrace Todd Bentley as my brother in Christ, I must take a higher road even if I don’t agree with his prayer methods or his claims regarding angels. Anything I say, even if it is corrective, must be said in love (see Eph. 4:15).
 
Thankfully a group of leaders from various charismatic camps (both “Blues” and “Grays”!) are discussing the contentious issues surrounding Lakeland—and biblical confrontation is occurring. I trust this process will result in correction where it’s needed, apologies when necessary and more humility on all sides of the debate.
 
3. Let’s pray for one another (see James 5:16). Jesus prayed that we would be one. There is no record of Him praying that we would split over doctrine. So why in the world would any of us hope for a Civil War?
 
Please pray for Bentley—and for the leaders who are speaking into his life during this season. And pray that the church will not only experience genuine spiritual revival but also true unity. Let’s work out our differences, support one another’s ministries and focus all our efforts on one common goal: To tell a lost world about the love of Jesus.

 J. Lee Grady is editor of Charisma.

People, this is how detached from reality we often get as Christians. First of all, the problems with Pentecostal and charismatic Christianity did not begin with Todd Bentley, and it won’t end with him. Look, there isn’t anything that Bentley is doing now that people like Benny Hinn haven’t been doing for DECADES. Second, the Crouch family has a global television network. Hello! Third, you have TONS of charismatic and Pentecostal movements in Asia, Latin America, and Africa that are syncretizing Christianity with local animist and pagan religions. Fourth, you have charismatic and Pentecostal Christians in the west that are going ever so closer to joining up with the Roman Catholic Church. (And speaking of the Crouches, they are paving the way for African and Arabic charismatics to join up with Islam, and the Roman Catholics are working on joining up with Muslims as well so that is a strange east – west thing going on there coordinated by the Vatican.) Fifth, you have the massive broad apostasy in the Word of Faith movement that asserts the deity of man while marginalizing or outright denying the deity of God. Sixth, there are the charismatics involved with the Center for National Policy and Council on Foreign Relations that are using their doctrines to ready the Christian world to support the new world order of anti – Christ globalism. So yes indeed, Todd Bentley is just a small part of what is going on, which is why I have not dedicated any real attention to him. 

Now I respect Grady as being a sincere fellow who wants Pentecostalism to be biblically based, and uses his forum to fight that battle. But he seems not to understand that with all of the documented heretical movements – to speak nothing of the scandals – that have dogged the Pentecostal movement FROM ITS VERY BEGINNING, choosing to go ahead and fight some battles so that you can separate the offenders (that is true Christians that are rejected by the world) from the pretenders before the world. This gives Grady an excellent opportunity to follow the example of Moses in Exodus 32:26 and say “Who is on the LORD’s side? let him come unto me!” We Christians need to see who are the Levites are that will stand up and be saved, versus those who will not: the bull worshipers are that will either outright support the apostasy, and who are the fence sitters that will watch the battle hoping to join the side of the winner. 

By using his position of influence to make this call, Grady can A) identify himself as being on the Lord’s side and B) make it publicly known that there are leading charismatics that care about sound doctrine and right practice. B) is particularly important because the born again charismatics need to know that there are good Christians in their movement whose fellowships they can join and pastors they can follow. But saying things like “But I don’t believe God wants to split our movement” … first of all if the charismatic movement is real it is God’s movement and not his, and a plain reading of the Bible knows that God WANTS apostates driven from His church. Second, his saying “I don’t believe God wants” … what, he isn’t SURE? He hasn’t received a revelation from the Holy Spirit? He doesn’t have a clear understanding from reading the Bible on what do do? If either is the case, then why speak? Why not be silent until he is sure that he is speaking for God and God is speaking through him lest the words that he speaks reflect the desires of his own flesh (or the desires of Satan as it were, and since Satan is the prince of this world the desires of the natural man and the desires of Satan are going to line up more often than not). 

I have to say that a great deal of Grady’s column seems to be straight from “the church of judge not” and the chapel of “touch not mine anointed and do my prophet no harm.” (All he lacks is a “sex sells especially in the church” reference and a “John Hagee slaughter every Muslim man and woman and rip up all their women with child so Jesus can come back” speech to make him 4 for 4.) I mean, his saying that we should pray for these false preachers … Grady is perfectly aware that the Bible says that we are not so much as bid apostate preachers God speed! 

So what is his agenda? I honestly wonder if Grady fears that a split in the Pentecostal movement would be bad press, and harm the group’s respectability in the eyes of the public and respectability in the Christian community, and Grady is willing to abide the doctrines and practices of a bunch of neo – gnostics, spiritists, and occultists just to keep his movement respectable and influential. If that is the case, then the call “who is on the Lord’s side, let him come to me” has already been made, and Grady has already chosen his side.

2 Responses to “Why Does J. Lee Grady Of Charisma Magazine Want To AVOID A Charismatic War?”

  1. >> First of all, the problems with Pentecostal and Charismatic Christianity…

    says the devil..

    such a loaded, biased, distorted false statement still firstly indicates more bad things solely ABOUT the poster AND not any of the Pentecostals.. and anyone who thinks this still is a Bonaire, valid post are grossly mistaken too

    and quoting Bible verses out of context too often too… such as Timothy 5:23 as a supposed justification now for drunkenness, alcoholics in the church is an absurd perversion is still too showing us all what false sprits they are being led by, not the holy Spirit for sure… who says there is a problem solely with them.. most fundamentals have just as much or often more theological errors, divisions, disputes, falsehoods it seems till too.. evangelicals seem to falsely substitute preaching to others, bashing the others for not living the Gospel of Jesus Christ still too

    (1 Cor 1:10 KJV) Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

    (1 Cor 3:3 KJV) For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?

    (1 Cor 11:18 KJV) For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it.
    19 For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you. 20 When ye come together therefore into one place, this is not to eat the Lord’s supper. 21 For in eating every one taketh before other his own supper: and one is hungry, and another is drunken. 22 What? have ye not houses to eat and to drink in? or despise ye the church of God, and shame them that have not? What shall I say to you? shall I praise you in this? I praise you not.

    isn’t is still amazing how many of these so called professing Christians now cannot even give up smoking, alcohol, beer and what else? for the lord Jesus Christ.. then they have not died to Christ yet but are wrongfully living to the flesh still too

    but there has always been an ungodly holy war between the unspiritual carnal persons and the holy spirit filled Christian persons so this is nothing new.. the carnal flesh opposes the spirit, the work of God often.

    http://thefocusonthefamily.wordpress.com/2008/06/30/abstainers/

  2. Lee Grady wants us to walk in agreement with the devil.
    SEEKABOOM BA
    http://www.scribd.com/doc/3871573/Todd-Bentley-Rick-JoinerThe-Cosmic-Tree-STAR-GATES-TO-THE-THIRD-HEAVEN-
    YOU’VE GOT TO SEE THIS DEMONIC BAPTISMS
    During the bizarre initiation ceremonial rite of eastern religious baptism, he wore a tee shirt with two rattle snakes that said, “Living Sacrifice. Like his tattoos, his choice of images for his tee shirts are demonic.
    http://www.experiencefestival.com/a/SiddhaMahayoga/id/34752
    TODD ~ MORE THAN WEIRD. CREEPY! MIXTURE Sanskrit language and believe me, he knows what he is saying. They are not Christian words they are demonic.
    “I baptize you,” he says, pushing them down into the water. “BAM! BAM! BAM! FIRE! FIRE! FIRE!”
    10. “fire, fire, fire” – see comments on kundalini “fire” in Bit No. 2.
    Someone who has their kundalini awakened is regarded as “on fire”, and to spread that awakening is to “ignite” others. The fire (called “tummo”) is regarded as the source of healings. (interesting that the name of the Lakeland Church is now called “Ignite.”
    “I baptize you,” he screams, “in the name of the Father, Son & Bam!”
    9. “bam-bam” – (BhaMBhaM) – to sodomize!
    This baptismal service on the 4th July, what can I say really of how it makes me grieve so (and God)? Such a blatant mockery of God, and such a blatant disregard for truth. It mocks the new life and the real miracle of being a new creation in Christ Jesus and the old being gone.
    At 2.05 minutes on this video, Todd goes ‘tsssss’ and pretends to put the fire/anointing in the water by putting his hand in there to heat the tub up with more anointing. This is play acting like a child and outright mockery – the work of a charlatan and not a true man of God.
    1. “I baptize you in the name of SEEKA BOOM BA,” the hissing snake is the Kundalini spirit manifesting and is not the anointing the of the Holy Spirit. “boomba” was pronounced over 3 (bhumba) – a holy vessel – specifically a Buddhist ritual water pot
    source: http://www.thethankahouse.com/ritual.html
    2. “sheeka” (zikhaa) – flame
    source: http://spokensanskrit.de/index.php?script=HK&tinput=sheeka&…
    People are ‘falling out under the power in the baptism tank’ but there is no talk of repentance or confession of sins or Jesus as Lord. There are Gnostic claims from Todd like ‘The fire is in the tub’, and nonsense such as ‘I baptize you in the name of the sheeka boom ba … bam’. At 2.10 minutes, Todd calls this ‘a mass sheeka boom ba’ – (you will see below what it means) why on earth does he use such nonsense words for a baptism – because I tell you the truth, it is no real baptism. To the undiscerning, these words sound kind of spiritual or Christian or like tongues (albeit without interpretation) but not only are these the words of a charlatan and faker, they are also the words of an evil man with an evil impartation.
    “Lord anoint him as an evangelist to take “IT” all over the world!” Bentley “anoints,” a young man who is violently manifesting the Kundalini demons, splashing and uncontrollably shaking and trembling in the water. These evil impartations when seen in Africa are called demonic and cast out while in America, they are laughed at and cheered as being the Holy Ghost!
    http://battle4truth.wordpress.com/2008/07/06/lakeland-baptism-extravaganza/
    Want to give your life to CHRIST?

    http://mail.google.com/mail/?shva=1#inbox/11b02f0a5c7ec46chttp://mail.google.com/mail/?shva=1#inbox/11b02f0a5c7ec46c
    These poor people will be demon possessed for the rest of their lives. This means they will be controlled and tormented by these Kundalini snake devils.
    Matthew 24:24-25 – “For false Christs and false prophets will arise and will show great signs and wonders, so as to mislead, if possible, even the elect. “Behold, I have told you in advance.”
    http://www.patholliday.com/
    Pat Holliday

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