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More Evidence That Rick Warren Is Working For One Global Religion

Posted by Job on May 14, 2008

Rick Warren Apologist Richard Abanes: Going soft on Mormonism, Is this the direction Rick Warren is Heading

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39 Responses to “More Evidence That Rick Warren Is Working For One Global Religion”

  1. Friend,

    This article “Rick Warren Apologist Richard Abanes: Going soft on Mormonism, Is this the direction Rick Warren is Heading” is a lie from beginning to end. And I would ask that for the sake of truth, and to avoid slandering a brother in Christ, that you remove it from your website.

    Mr. Baker is completely misrepresenting my book “Inside Today’s Mormonism,” which is NOT in any way seeking ANY kind of synthesis with Mormonism, nor is it going SOFT on Mormonism. It is actually a lengthy REFUTATION of every manor doctrine of Mormonism and is distributed by some of the most well-respected ministries to Mormons including Sandra Tanner’s Utah Lighthouse Ministry and Bill McKeever’s Mormonism Research Ministry. Feel free to verify my position on Mormonism and the contents of the book about which John Baker has blatantly lied.

    For the record. Mormonism is a false religion. It is not Christian and there can be no blending of anything Mormon or Christian. Their concepts of God, Jesus, the Bible, salvation, and man are unbiblical and based on the false writings of their founding prophet Joseph Smith and his extra-biblical revelations.

    “Inside Today’s Mormonism is my second book on Mormonism. It deals specifically with doctrine, whereas my first book on Mormonism, “One Nation Under Gods,” reveals the sordid past of Mormonism and its dark origins based on the occult practices of Joseph Smith.

    Again, I ask that you remove this link and avoid being a participant in slander, falsely accusing the brethren, and dividing the Body of Christ.

    In Him,

    Richard Abanes

  2. Job said

    Richard Abanes:

    I noticed that your comments did not appear on the post that I linked to. Is there a reason for that?

  3. Richard Abanes, will you write another book about Rick Warren, this time detailing how HE is dividing the body of Christ with HIS false doctrine?

    Just More of Rick Warren Showing Why You Should Avoid Him.

    Rick Warren Explains His Desire For the World. (Davos) This Time I’ll Let You Sound The Alarm.

  4. Job,

    You mean comment over at Mr. Baker’s blog? I didn’t comment over there because I have already sought to correct Baker, telling him exactly what I believe about Mormonism, but he refuses to: 1) remove the lies; 2) read the book; 3) contact any ministries to Mormons to verify my position.

    My appeal to you was just that – an appeal to you for your own website here. Baker is not interested in the truth. He is only interested in slander and accusing the brethren. It is all very grievous. I hope you take the tim eto investigate the truth.

    peace in Him,

    RAbanes

  5. John said

    Mr. Abanes,

    Is famous for travelling the internet to “defend” Rick Warren’s Apostasy and abominations.

    He tries to go so far to say that my article is a lie. What he does not understand becasue he does not have any Spiritual discernment is the article was right on the money!

    Might I suggest taking a look at this video:

    Now does this say anything at all about what Rick Warren thinks of Scripture? Of clear Biblical Truth? Of who and what it is that actually saves man? Do his words ring with the familiar phraseology of fallen post modern relativistic humanism? Are they not the absolute worst in Synchretism?

    I dont allow Mr Abanes the airplay or internet bandwidth to spread his deceptions. He does not come to web sites to seek the truth. He comes to defend Rick Warren regardless of the truth.

    God Bless All,

    John Baker

  6. John said

    the link to the video:

  7. John said

    I would also like to point out that Mr Abanes has a nasty habit of accusing others of un-Christian like language in comment threads where he is a participant.

    While at the same time he ignores his consistent use of un-christian like language and dis-rspectful terminology.

    In this thread I would point out his usage of “Baker” to alude to me.

    MR. Abanes, I would tell you that before you wag your fingers at others for what you consider un-Christian like language you might want to adress your own actions in that regard.

    I would also suggest you stop referring to yoursef as part of the “Brethren”! Or as one being falsely represented to “the Brethren”

    I for one do not consider you part of “the Brethren” i.e those who are true followers of Christ!

  8. Independent,

    greetings. My position on Rick Warren as been stated in several articles, some of which address the very issues raised by you and others. That is my right as an American to express myself.

    Now, for the sake of discussion, let us just say I am completely wrong about Rick Warren, that still would not justify the false accusations being made about me and my views of Mormonism by John Baker. I hope you see this and are just as concerned about correct Mr. Baker as you are about correcting me.

    ______
    MR. Baker: Is famous for travelling the internet to “defend” Rick Warren’s Apostasy and abominations.

    RA: I have been posting about Rick Warren on blogs and at my own site for barely 5 months, in a full-time, apologetic ministry spanning nearly 20 years beginning with my employment at Walter Martin’s Christian Research Institute in 1989. I would hardly call the miniscule portion of material I’ve written on Warren as reason to say it is what I am “famous” for. In fact, the truth is, I am actually famous for nothing.

    ________
    Mr. Baker: He tries to go so far to say that my article is a lie. What he does not understand because he does not have any Spiritual discernment is the article was right on the money!

    RA: My position on Mormonism is well know, respected, and supported by dedicated ministries to Mormons. And the content of my books on Mormonism clearly reveal I am in no way seeking ANYTHING remotely close to what Baker alleges in his slanderous article. My books dismantle both Mormon history and Mormon doctrine, showing it to be a false religion TOTALLY incompatible with true Christianity.

    peace in Christ,

    RAbanes

  9. JOHN: I for one do not consider you part of “the Brethren” i.e those who are true followers of Christ!

    RA: The ultimate slander. Judgment will come.

    – – – – – –
    “Now have come the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God, and the authority of his Christ. For the accuser of our brothers, who accuses them before our God day and night, has been hurled down. (Rev. 12:10)

    – – – – –
    “[Satan} was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies.

    – – – – –
    “Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor” (Ex. 23:1).
    “Be not a witness against thy neighbor without cause; and deceive not with thy lips” (Prov. 24:28).
    “[D]o not love perjury; for all these are what I hate, declares the LORD” (Zech 8:17).
    “[H]e who spreads slander is a fool” (Prov. 10:18).

  10. Job said

    Richard Abanes:

    Why does Rick Warren give seminars with Mormons teaching them how to grow their churches?

  11. He doesn’t and he never has. This rumor has been spread because of a secular author who wrote it in her USA Today article. Here is the truth:

    According to Brian Davis, Manager of Customer Care, Purpose Driven, no Mormons have ever been through any purpose driven pastor training or conferences or classes-according to all records. More importantly, Warren has never said that his programs “welcome” Mormons.

    In comments he made to USA Today during an interview, he spoke of “denominations” (Methodist, Baptists, Pentecostals, etc.). The reference to “Mormons” was actually the interpretation made by the USA Today journalist of what Warren meant by “denominations”. (The section about Mormons, BTW, was NOT in quotes).

    I learned this through several emails exchanged with Cathy Lynn Grossman on April 8, 2005 and a telephone conversation with her on April 27, 2005. The USA Today writer told me that she innocently penned her story for a secular media outlet using Webster’s definition of “denomination” – i.e., a “religious group.” It was Grossman who who chose the denominations (or “religious groups”) to put in the list, believing they sounded best in the article. Warren himself did not say, and indeed, he is not quoted as saying, that he views Mormons as simply other “denominations” that he teaches.

    Rick Warren’s direct quote about Mormonism and other cults is as follows: “[The Apostle]Paul says that they were zealous but ‘their zeal is not based on knowledge.'” That describes a lot of cults and religions today. A lot of Jehovah’s Witness are zealous without knowledge, and Mormons, [and] Moonies. Paul says they are zealous but they don’t really know the truth.” (Rick Warren “The Truth Is For Everybody,” part 26, n.d.; Rick Warren, “Discovering Life Mission,” CLASS 401).

    R. Abanes

  12. Richard Abanes, you are the one who has been running defense for heretic Rick Warren, not John. Rick Warren teaches a form of works based righteousness.

    So given you defend the heresy of Rick, I can’t assume you’re any better with the cult of Joseph Smith.

    Generally speaking, I side with John.

    I’ve had many a discussion with John. I know he stands against heresy like Rick Warren’s and against Mormonism with a righteous judgement. While you Richard defend Rick Warren and show poor discernment.

    So if John says you’re no good, I’m certain you’re no good.

    Howdy John!

  13. And Richard Abanes, if you have not already done so by the time this comment appears, try answering Job’s question.

  14. Job said

    Richard Abanes:

    Really? http://www.alittleleaven.com/2007/05/rick_warren_wor.html

    Click Here to Visit the http://Pastors.com website

    Rather than repudiate the article’s claims regarding Warren’s training of Mormons and Jews, Rick Warren instead asked for people to pray that the article would be successful in introducing the “The Purpose-Driven Life to a whole new secular audience.”

    Rick Warren obviously approved of this article and its contents.

    And what of this open letter from Rick Warren to Muslims?

    http://www.yale.edu/faith/abou-commonword.htm

    Key quote:

    “What is so extraordinary about A Common Word Between Us and You is not that its signatories recognize the critical character of the present moment in relations between Muslims and Christians. It is rather a deep insight and courage with which they have identified the common ground between the Muslim and Christian religious communities. What is common between us lies not in something marginal nor in something merely important to each. It lies, rather, in something absolutely central to both: love of God and loveof neighbor.”

    Of course, Muslims believe that they worship the same God as we do. It is our job to tell them that they are wrong, that they are actually worshiping the ancient near eastern sun god. Right? Has Warren had his universalist meeting with the Muslims yet? By the way, the original name of the Muslim moon god? SIN. The children of Israel spent 40 years wandering in the wilderness of Sin and went to mount Sinai? It was so named because the pagan people in the area named the region after the dominant deity that they were worshiping. https://healtheland.wordpress.com/2007/10/19/the-original-name-of-the-muslim-moon-god-not-allah/

    So, Christians worship God. Muslims worship Sin. When Rick Warren claimed in this letter that “we both share a love for God”, I interpret it as Warren saying “we both share a love for SIN.” What about you?

  15. Independent,

    Job’s question has been answered. And as for my stand on Mormonism, I simply invite you to:

    1. Call Sandra Tanner (Utah Lighthouse Ministry) or Bill McKeever (Mormonism Research Ministries) – or ANY respected Mormon ministry and ask them about the contents of my books on Mormonism, including the one referenced by John; or

    2. Just look at the book Baker references, and you’ll be able to easily tell that the book is a full, hard, refutation of Mormonism – as opposed to what John has said.

    _________
    JOHN: So if John says you’re no good, I’m certain you’re no good.

    RA: And THAT is what you call biblical discernment? God help us all. The fact is that Mr. Baker is not telling the truth about my position on Mormonism. It SEEMS to me that he is making nothing more than an attempt to harm personal and professional reputation in the Christian community. And that is libel. It can easily be proven by just taken steps 1 and 2 above.

  16. Job said

    Richard Abanes:

    Actually, no, not really. See https://healtheland.wordpress.com/2008/05/14/more-evidence-that-rick-warren-is-working-for-one-global-religion/#comment-29167 (or just the comment above) for a contest of your assertion as well as another question.

  17. This is not a thread about Rick Warren. This is a thread about my supposed sympathy for Mormonism, and Mr. John Baker’s false assertion that my book “Inside Today’s Mormonism” is a blatant attempt to synthesis Mormonism and Christianity. That is a bold-faced lie. And it can easily be shown as a lie to anyone willing to look at the facts. Baker has misrepresented my views, my faith, my commitment to scripture, my integrity, and my work. That is why I posted here – I did not post here to get into yet another battle about Rick Warren. let’s deal with John Baker’s lies — anyone interested?

  18. Job said

    Richard Abanes:

    ‘This is not a thread about Rick Warren”

    The title of the thread is “More Evidence That Rick Warren Is Working For One Global Religion”

  19. The title of the LINK is “Rick Warren Apologist Richard Abanes: Going soft on Mormonism, Is this the direction Rick Warren is Heading”

    My supposed softening on Mormonism is the link given as supposed evidence of the primary heading of the thread. I am here to correct you for posting that link based on falsehood as evidence of anything.

  20. Richard Abanes, answer Job’s question already! Read the above comments from Job again and answer. He is the one allowing you to comment here.

    Job has affirmed this post is about Rick Warren and efforts towards a global false religion. But as for your Mormonism book, John cited a quote straight out of your book. He even posted a graphic of the actual page from your book. He then had dialog with you about your book.

    So here’s John who cited straight from your book. And you, Rick warn defender.

    I’m still supporting John.

  21. 1. I answered the question about Rick Warren and Mormons by using: a) the testimony of the person who WROTE the article (Kathy Lynn Grossman); and b) a statement documenting Rick Warren’s views on Mormonism — i.e., it is a FALSE religion (he even called it a cult).

    2. As for John, citing “a quote straight out of” my book, people take sentences and quotes out of context from books (including the Bible) ALL THE TIME and use those quotes to lie. That’s what John has done.

    WHAT DON’T YOU UNDERSTAND ABOUT: “Mormonism is a false religion. It is not Christian and there can be no blending of anything Mormon or Christian. Their concepts of God, Jesus, the Bible, salvation, and man are unbiblical and based on the false writings of their founding prophet Joseph Smith and his extra-biblical revelations. ‘Inside Today’s Mormonism’ is my second book on Mormonism. It deals specifically with doctrine, whereas my first book on Mormonism, ‘One Nation Under Gods,’ reveals the sordid past of Mormonism and its dark origins based on the occult practices of Joseph Smith.”

    WHAT DON’T YOU UNDERSTAND ABOUT: 1. Call Sandra Tanner (Utah Lighthouse Ministry) or Bill McKeever (Mormonism Research Ministries) – or ANY respected Mormon ministry and ask them about the contents of my books on Mormonism, including the one referenced by John; or 2. Just look at the book Baker references, and you’ll be able to easily tell that the book is a full, hard, refutation of Mormonism – as opposed to what John has said.

    I am TELLING you what I believe. And you are ignoring it to believe what someone else says I believe! Call the Mormon ministries. Call them! Why won’t you call them? This is unreal. They know that I am making NO attempt to break down the wall that exists, and should exist, between Mormonism and Christianity.

    The quote John ripped horrifically out of context refers to meaningless verbal fighting and talking past others in an angry hateful way that renders them and us unable to hear each other, thereby short-circuiting successful evangelism.

    As anyone can see who reads the book, the sentence is followed by the words: “Neither group can afford to maintain animosity for each other” because Scripture declares that “we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against rulers of darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places” (Ephesians 6:12).

    Clearly, I am dealing with how we need to interact with Mormons, while keeping a right attitude of love and respect per scripture (see 1 Peter 3:15, 1 Tim. 2;24-25. 2 Tim. 4:2). This is consistent with my approach, which is to reflect Christ the the commands scripture gives us when witnessing to those who do not know Jesus (see my article on witnessing to Mormons, http://abanes.com/SBTJessay.html ).

    R. Abanes

    You now have the truth. It is between you and God. I remind you of the scripture I posted above about lying and slander.

  22. Oh, and Job, I do very much appreciate you allowing my comments here. It has been very gracious of you. And I give you my thanks. I just wanted to offer you the truth about my stand on Mormonism – that’s all. I won’t bother your website any longer. 🙂

    peace,

    RAbanes

  23. Richard Abanes – I think you just like Rick Warren play both sides. And all you do is run cover for him. And you really have not addressed what was asked of you here.

    So how about you prove to us John has taken your statement out of context. John posted a portion of about 1/4 a page. How about you post ON YOUR OWN WEB SITE say 5 pages of your book, the 2 pages prior and 2 pages after what was cited along with the full page of what was cited. 5 pages should be more than enough to know the context is accurate.

  24. Richard Abanes, (I’m sure you’ll be back although you said you’re leaving) there is an easy way for you to post not just the 5 pages I mentioned, but even more of your book for search and review.

    I’m an author. How do I add my books to Google Book Search?

    Just submit the book there with the 5 plus some other pages. Then we can all read some of it ourselves and see. If you made the book for the sake of ministry and not just personal profit, I’m sure you would not mind placing portions of your book in an online search resource like Google books search.

    Let us see what is in the book ourselves instead of you having to worry about this back and forth. If a mistake was made, help clear it up by posting some of the book online free for all to see.

  25. Hello IC,

    I have had the entire introduction posted on my website for months! See my excerpt page titled: “Inside Today’s Mormonism:
    Understanding Latter-day Saints in Light of Biblical Truth

    SEE http://abanes.com/excerptlds.html

    __________
    IC: “John posted a portion of about 1/4 a page.”

    RA: Actually – HE DIDN’T. What he actually has posted is a doctored image! He took part of p. 9 and stuck on top of p. 19 (end of introduction), leaving out 18 pages in between that outlined what my book is about!!!!

    Now, THAT is deception. You can read the introduction for yourself on my website at the above link.

    R. Abanes

  26. John said

    A way in which to get Mr. Abanes to show his “hand” is ask him if Roman Catholicism is a valid Christian Faith, then watch him bob and weave to avoid answering the question.

    In regards to his stance on Mormonism I stand by my article. Mr. Abanes has repeatedly said in comment threads on other web sites, that he believes Mormons are not “ALL WRONG” in everything that they believe.

    Mr Abanes believes that you can “dialogue” with Mormons and concentrate in that dialogue on the “beliefs” that both Christians and Moromons share and use that as a starting point in which to bring Mormons into the fold, so to speak.

    Of course Mr Abanes beliefs like Rick Warren’s beliefs would bring them into a “fold” that is not Biblical Christianity but a heretical belief system (synchronistic). Their beliefs are derived from Atheistic Humanism and not on Biblical Christianity.

    As far as Mr Abanes book I do have a copy and Mr Abanes I HAVE READ IT, And you do use soft language on Mormonism. You use the language of Dead Post-Modern Humanism not Biblical Christianity!

    Mr Abanes thnks because he can speak like a Christian then that makes him one. Unfortunately it does not!

    Mr Abanes and Rick Warren constantly harp on about the fact that they hold to the five basics of Fundamentalism, but what they do is they add so much Atheistic Humanistic Ideology to their beliefs and also reinterpret those five fundamentals to the point that they make them “OF NONE AFFECT”

    Mr Abanes is nothing more than a smooth talking WOLF!

    For proof of how Rick Warren like Mr Abanes twists and BREAKS Scripture listen to the video:

  27. Job said

    John:

    Ever since Billy Graham, virtually no evangelicals are going to take a hard line stance against the Roman Catholic Church. Accepting Roman Catholics opened the door to accepting everyone else.

  28. Richard Abanes, John made it apparent that he was using 2 sections of the book. There is a break in his graphic, to make it most apparent. I was talking about the larger portion, which apparently came from page 19 of your book. Looking at the “introduction” that includes page 19, it is clear without doubt that John’s assessment is accurate.

    Mr. Abanes, here is some scripture for you to consider.

    1 Corinthians 2:1-2 (New American Standard Bible)

    1 And when I came to you, brethren, I did not come with superiority of speech or of wisdom, proclaiming to you the testimony of God.

    2 For I determined to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ, and Him crucified.

    It’s clear you see Mormons as a group that are to be “won over” with a persuasive speech. Which is really core to the Charles Finney (and Rick Warren) way of seeing things.

    Richard, apostates are not to be subjects for “dialog” after they’ve rejected truth. They are to be noted and avoided, unless they repent.

    Romans 16:17 (New American Standard Bible)

    17 Now I urge you, brethren, keep your eye on those who cause dissensions and hindrances contrary to the teaching which you learned, and turn away from them.

    Your way Richard fails to affirm the truth of how to deal with apostates. Scripture says turn away, while you seek more “dialog”. So you’re not standing on sound teaching. It is right that your book be noted as something to avoid, because it does attempt to be soft on a serious problem. In your own softness and defense of heretic Rick Warren you’ve become a problem yourself.

    Daniel Chew was correct to say of you:

    After looking through various comments by Abanes on various blogs, I can only say that all I see is someone so blind that he cannot even see his own pride and arrogance. The stench of self-righteousness just radiates from him, and informs his perpetual “crusade” against Christian pastors (Pastor Ken Silva, Dr. Kim Riddlebarger, Pastor John MacArthur etc.), watchmen ministries (Lighthouse Trails Research etc.) and an entire denomination (Chuck Smith and Calvary Chapel), whoever opposes Rick Warren will feel his wrath, regardless of who or what they are. I just can’t understand how such an individual can function really, so deluded that he cannot even see his own pride. And mind you, it is not God or the Scriptures he is defending, but one man who does in fact severely compromises the faith, as a couple of us have exposed his heresy via books. Not to mention the outright denial of the Gospel at the World Economic Forum at Davos where he cheerfully said in the Interfaith session chaired by former British Primer Minister Tony Bair that “The future is not about secularism, but religious pluralism”.

    What’s the Matter With Rick Warren? A Lot!

    If You Are A Christian and Disagreed With Me About Rick Warren Before, I Doubt You’ll Continue Disagreeing With Me After Seeing This!

    My “dialog” with you is finished Mr. Abanes. As I’ve told you already, my method is as scripture says, avoid those who cause dissensions and hindrances contrary to sound teaching. That includes you. You like the dialog, because hey, you’ve got books to sell on Amazon.com. You defend Rick Warren, because you believe the false doctrine he’s teaching, Luke 6:39-40.

    Rick Warren Asks the Money Changers to Partner With The Church. This Could Be Worse Than Faith Based Funding.

  29. “John’s assessment is accurate.”

    You people are beyond all hope.

  30. JOHN: “I do have a copy and Mr Abanes I HAVE READ IT, And you do use soft language on Mormonism. You use the language of Dead Post-Modern Humanism not Biblical Christianity!”

    RA: Really? You have the book and you have read it? Okay, then. On page 183, what does the sentence say after the words “DID YOU KNOW?,” which appear in the gray box in the center of the page? And what are the bullet points that follow that sentence?

    While we’re at it, let’s see what respected, well-known, biblically-sound, evangelical ministries to Mormons say about the book’s contents. And let’s take a look at what die-hard, Bible-based apologists say. Oh, and I’ve included some reviews as well.
    _________________________________________
    “In what appears to be a sequel to his well-researched book ‘One Nation Under Gods,’ Richard Abanes provides ‘a closer look at 21st-century Mormonism.’ And overall, he is successful, dealing with such issues as Joseph Smith, God, and polygamy. The issue is, how do Mormons think today (or, at least, how are they taught by their LDS Church leaders), and Abanes provides abundant documentation to show that this material is more than just his personal opinion. . . . Although Mormons may not like Abanes’ analysis, there is no arguing with his facts. I think he did a very thorough job reporting the differences, making it very clear what Mormonism teaches and showing ‘Evangelical Thoughts’ (in subtitles) to counter the doctrine(s). . . . Overall, I recommend Becoming Gods for both the layperson and scholar.”
    – Eric Johnson, Mormonism Research Ministries

    “Abanes has produced a helpful book for the general Christian public. He combines careful research with journalistic skill to give us insight to some of the major errors of Mormon doctrine, but does so in a respectful manner so that his words may be read, hopefully, by Mormons who are willing to reevaluate the teachings of their religion. . . . I commend him for his work and believe that Christians will be greatly benefited by reading Inside Today’s Mormonism.”
    – H. Wayne House, author and Distinguished Professor of Biblical and Theological Studies at Faith Seminary

    “What are the differences between The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter–day Saints and orthodox, evangelical Christianity? Abanes has written an in–depth book that thoroughly unpacks both belief systems. Inside Today’s Mormonism treats Mormon beliefs and history with respect, while pulling no punches when examining the evidence. For a book that covers so much theological and historical ground, it’s easy to follow.”
    —CBA Marketplace

    “It is a vital book to anyone wanting understanding of how current Mormon thinking stacks against the Bible and evangelical standards. I would highly recommend it to both Christians and Mormons, because Abanes has presented his findings in a forthright, respectful manner appropriate to all.”
    —ChristianBookPreviews.com
    ______________________________________

    JOHN: “he believes Mormons are not “ALL WRONG” in everything that they believe.”

    RA: You lie again by taking what I have said and twisting it to continue your persecution of the saints. What I have said about Mormons is that they are WRONG, WRONG, WRONG on all doctrinal issues. Can I be any clearer anyone?

    What I think John might be referring to (although only God really know) would perhaps be comments I’ve made about all religions, including Mormons, having certain things right like: murder is sinful, stealing is not biblical, abortion is wrong, etc. etc. etc. How in the world John interprets this as me being “soft” on Mormonism or how it’s seeking a synthesis with Mormonism is something is beyond me! His hateful imagination is beginning to run wild, imho.
    ___________
    IC: It’s clear you see Mormons as a group that are to be “won over” with a persuasive speech.

    RA: Ahhhh, really, I see. Then you’re saying that you believe Paul the apostle is also a false prophet and heretic. Well, John, seems like YOU are the one who has turned away from scripture:

    “As his custom was, Paul went into the synagogue, and on three Sabbath days he reasoned with them from the Scriptures” (Acts 17:2).

    “They arrived at Ephesus, where Paul left Priscilla and Aquila. He himself went into the synagogue and REASONED with the Jews.” (Acts 18:19).

    RAbanes

    PS. I implore any of you to call ANY Mormon ministry and ask them if I am soft or compromising on Mormonism. If John is telling the truth, then they – of ALL people – should be able to verify is assertions. I certainly have nothing to fear — so call them. Ex-Mormons for Jesus, Utah Lighthouse Ministry, Mormonism Research Ministries, Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry – pick one. Go ahead. Pick any of them.

  31. Richard are you kidding me? You go around and call people liars and you make this statement.
    “I have been posting about Rick Warren on blogs and at my own site for barely 5 months,”
    What??
    I know you took a couple years of doing Lord knows what but you had your old blog up and you were blasting me at Tim Challis website in 2005. So really who is the liar?
    I also dont appreciate you doing a drive by at my website and just stating “Stop lying” without statimg what I was lying about or what inaccuracies or untruths were in my articles.
    I guessed that it was because you promote the new age method of prayer called centering prayer in your book “Rick Warren and the Purpose that Drives Him” on page 137. Now you do state that people should not conform to new age practices of this prayer but any discerning Christian knows that this is not a Christian form or prayer in any way shape or form. But again I know you have to endorse this because your leader endorses this as well as breath prayers.
    John Baker’s article is spot on and it amazes’s me that you really still dont get what John was pointing out in the article.
    Plus do you really want to mention Walter Martin here?
    Or was this article untrue?
    http://www.cultlink.com/sentinel/rische-abanes.htm
    Plus I notice that you had no comments on the false teacher you follow and his comments on the current U Tube video thats going around.
    Richard you really need to wake up.
    Tim

  32. TIM: I know you took a couple years of doing Lord knows what but you had your old blog up and you were blasting me at Tim Challis website in 2005. So really who is the liar?

    RA: I originally posted some articles in mid-2005 for A BRIEF PERIOD of time. I subsequently took those articles down and said nothing about Warren for nearly 3 years in hopes of you and others repenting and seeing the truth on your own. I started re-posting on blogs again at the very end of Dec. 2007 because it had become so grievous – about 5 months ago. (And BTW, I had lunch with Tim Challies and we get a long just fine. He’s a great guy, it seems. I consider him a friendly acquaintance.)

    _____________
    TIM: I also dont appreciate you doing a drive by at my website and just stating “Stop lying” without statimg what I was lying about or what inaccuracies or untruths were in my articles.

    RA: I don’t appreciate the lies I have ALREADY made you aware of.

    _____________
    TIM: Now you do state that people should not conform to new age practices of this prayer but any discerning Christian knows that this is not a Christian form or prayer in any way shape or form. But again I know you have to endorse this because your leader endorses this as well as breath prayers.”

    RA: Centering prayer as been addressed. breath prayers, so-called, have been addressed. This thread, since you seem to need reminding, is about my stand on Mormonism – something else you have seen fit to lie about.

    ______________
    TIM: John Baker’s article is spot on and it amazes’s me that you really still don’t get what John was pointing out in the article.

    RA: It’s very clear that John is pointing out in his article. He is seeking to impugn my character and reputation by alleging that I am seeking a synthesis between Christianity and Mormonism – and that my book “Inside Today’s Mormonism” is soft on Mormonism, when in reality, it refutes every foundational tenet of Mormonism, using scripture and rational arguments. You are perpetrating that lie. You, therefore, are party to that sin.

    ______________
    TIM: http://www.cultlink.com/sentinel/rische-abanes.htm

    RA: ROFL. TES, I DO want to mention Walter Martin. And YES, that article is untrue. Funny you didn’t notice the the EXACT same publisher of Walter Martin’s The Kingdom of the Cults is the same publisher of my newest book on Eckhart Tolle. Hmmmmmm, what might that mean? Maybe it means that the publisher has information YOU don’t have and information that certain unnamed people aren’t will to make public because then they couldn’t attack me. The truth is in the hands of the people who matter. And that would be the publisher – I guess it’s obvious who’s in the right since they are just a bout to release another book by me — and not my accusers.

    ________________
    TIM: Richard you really need to wake up.

    RA: Actually, you need to do far more than just wake up. You need to repent.

    RAbanes

  33. Job said

    Richard Abanes:

    “I subsequently took those articles down and said nothing about Warren for nearly 3 years in hopes of you and others repenting and seeing the truth on your own.”

    I have already repented and seen the truth on my own. 3 years ago you said? Well three years ago I was following Pat Robertson, Paul and Jan Crouch, Rod Parsley, Kenneth Copeland, John Hagee, Paula White, Joyce Meyer, Jesse DuPlantis, Creflo Dollar, Eddie Long, Fred Price, Robert Schuller, Tim LaHaye … watching them on TV, buying their merchandise, sending them money, calling their prayer lines, you name it. I was not nearly so much a supporter of Rick Warren because I knew relatively little about him, but what I did know of him I supported.

    But I woke up and saw that those guys, Warren included, were pervasive in their opposition to what the Bible actually says. I also found out that these guys, Warren included, have vast networks that they use to grow and maximize their wealth and influence, and that they also preach doctrines that help promote that agenda. I also found out about groups like the Council on Foreign Relations, the Center for National Policy, etc. that Warren and many of these leading preachers members of and how influential THEY are. And when I found out about all of this stuff (while in the process of doing internet research for a web site that I was maintaining IN SUPPORT of people like these, where I was basically regurgitating what I was “learning” on The 700 Club, TBN, Christianity Today, the Word Network, etc.) as well as all of the false doctrines, sex scandals, financial scandals, and their willingness to hang out with other notorious crooks, liars, heretics, and cheats, do you know what I did?

    Not only did I repent and stop following these people, I started this website so that others could learn the truth, repent, and stop following these people as well. Regrettably, most of the people that come here are people like you who despite fully knowing the false doctrines and wrong dealings of their pastors continue to support them. Case in point: your stating “this is not a thread about Rick Warren” when I had incontrovertibly demonstrated to you that Warren was doing the indefensible. Rather than admit it, you chose to change the subject.

    The truth is, Richard, that Warren does and has his hands into things that are so deadly in terms of being dangerously false that it is amazing that people haven’t risen up against him the way they did Joseph Smith back in the 1800s. Instead, the Southern Baptist Convention won’t even kick him out! It just shows how much less respect for God this country has in these last days.

  34. JOB: Rather than admit it, you chose to change the subject.

    RA: The top of page reads: “More Evidence That Rick Warren Is Working For One Global Religion — Rick Warren Apologist Richard Abanes: Going soft on Mormonism, Is this the direction Rick Warren is Heading.”

    If you’d like to separate these two issues, then that would be fine with me. Then, we can deal with my views on Mormonism, if you desire to do so. But you are USING my supposed softness on Mormonism to substantiate something you believe about Rick Warren. But what you are linking about me and Mormonism is a LIE. It is proof of nothing. It is suggestive of nothing. Because it is a LIE. if you wish to continue advancing Mr. Baker’s lying article, then that is between you and God – and you will have to answer to Him.

    RAbanes

  35. Here is what I posted on John’s site in reference to this article. And, by the way, quoting what Paul said about avoiding those who cause divisions is out of context. Paul was speaking about those IN THE CHURCH who were causing divisions by their false teachings. Mormons are not a part of the church. Paul did in fact “dialog” with the pagans at the Areopagus. You people should try working with Mormons before you make such judgmental statements about proper evangelical methods. Anyway, herewith is my post from John’s site:

    Greetings, John, and everyone else,

    I am an ex-Mormon and have studied the LDS church from an apologetics standpoint for over 30 years, amassing a well-equipped library on LDS studies, including copies of many of their ancient works. I also have a copy of Richard Abanes’ book, “Inside Today’s Mormonism..”

    I have a few comments I’d like to add to your collection. Firstly, I think Abanes’ support of Rick Warren is wrong, period. However, his support of Warren and the “Purpose-Driven” fad has nothing whatsoever to do with his stance on Mormonism. Just because he is, in my humble opinion, biblically out of step concerning Warren, to then attack him on his stance with Mormonism is illogical as well as ludicrous.

    Reading your comments about Abanes’ book leads me to believe you never read it or you would not have come to the conclusion you have come to. What you show of his introduction is out of context.

    To begin with, Mormons should never be our foes any more than unbelievers are our foes, simply because Mormons are unbelievers themselves. They are not the enemy, rather the enemy is Satan who blinds their eyes to the truth. These are people who are deceived and who need the true gospel preached to them. You certainly don’t win them to the Lord by treating them as enemies. Did Paul consider the pagans at the Areopagus as enemies just because they worshiped false gods or did he see them as people who needed the truth?

    Over the years the LDS has been stronger and stronger in their apologetics defense, and if we don’t change with the times we will not be able to reach them with the truth. I know because I have worked with
    Mormons since becoming a Christian 34 years ago and have seen the change in the tactics of their defense.
    While I have been able to go with each change due to my personal knowledge, not everyone is so equipped.
    Richard Abanes’ book is a gold mine of information about how to deal with Mormon apologetics so as to win them to the true gospel and will equip those who are interested in saving Mormons from eternal death rather than seeing them as foes to avoid.

    I do not know Mr. Abanes other than as an author of books I read. You may have legitimate beefs with him for some of his “purpose-driven” teachings and support of Rick Warren, but don’t falsely represent his views on the Mormon Church. In this aspect of your article I have to say you are indeed bearing false witness.

  36. This Open Letter to Steve Camp outlines my initial thoughts/intentions/motivation for writing to Ken Silva’s ISP. It also covers various issues relating to the “Ken Silva vs. Richard Abanes” controversy, including:

    1. Bible Study notes on key passages being discussed,
    2. the actual contents of my email to Silva’s ISP,
    3. observations about the current state of the church,
    4. an indictment of today’s so-called Online Discernment Ministries, and
    5. documentation of Ken Silva’s violation of federal copyright/privacy laws, and other issues.

    The open letter should answer most questions and addressed the widely-read article by Steve Camp titled “Battles in the Blogsphere.”

    This is my final word on the issue. Those who have ears to hear, and eyes to see, will both hear and see the truth.

    Richard Abanes
    Pop Culture Mix

  37. Here’s dirty rat Richard back again and he brought a friend with him this time.

    Richard KNOWS his claim of making a ‘final word’ is bogus. He’s going to keep yakking, dirty rat.

    And Morons claim to be part of the church, they claim to be Christians, so they are so-called brothers, false brothers, of another gospel, of another jesus and all the avoidance of them noted by Paul in 1 Corinthians 5, 2 Corinthians 11 and Galatians 1 totally applies.

    Which of the pagans at the Areopagus claimed to follow “Jesus”?

  38. A Few Words on Richard Abanes and Repentance

  39. […] As if I already did not know this from Abanes’ initial comments on this website claiming that … (this despite the fact that I have read and placed on this very website official press releases signed by Council on Foreign Relations worker and business partner with the world’s biggest pornographer Rupert Murdoch Rick Warren saying the opposite), this really does put his efforts to silence Ken Silva’s Apprising Ministries into context! […]

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