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Abrahamic Faith Continues The Battle Against Rick Warren Purpose Driven Apostasy In Southern Baptist Convention

Posted by Job on November 19, 2007

*Please note: I have Republican presidential candidate Mike Huckabee tagged here because as a minister he achieved phenomenal growth in his church using the Rick Warren Purpose Driven formula, and it was on that basis that he became president of the Arkansas Southern Baptist Convention, and it was based largely on that Huckabee Hound took the Arkansas governorship. This missive illustrates why Christians SHOULD NOT want this Rick Warren disciple in the White House. The way that Mitt Romney supporters have been going after Huckabee lately (see here where an entire site whose entire purpose for existing I invalidate here calls Huckabee’s supporters stupid and accuses them of being responsible for the New Hampshire push poll) shows that Huckabee has a real shot of winning this thing. What will happen will happen, but biblical Christians should read this and understand that no matter what James Dobson, Chuck Norris, and other prominent evangelical Christian leaders ultimately wind up doing, we should not support Huckabee any more than we should support Romney.

From James Sundquist of Rock Salt Publishing:

SOUTHERN BAPTIST CONVENTION PRESIDENT RETALIATES AGAINST JAMES SUNDQUIST RE RICK WARREN

Here is my Warren update:

In light of Dr. Frank Page having just spoken at the Florida Baptist Convention this week, please be alerted to the following response to Dr. Frank Page. There is another side of the story which contradicts his own published statement and campaign theme.

I sent the following response to SBC President Frank Page’s retaliation against me and my original appeal to him to several hundred Southern Baptist Pastor and leaders in the U.S. Not one single pastor responded with even an iota of concern for the SOS calls and emails I received from all over the world from Purpose Driven victims. Not one single SBC pastor responded with any concerns about Rick Warren’s false teachings. However, a host of them asked to be removed from my mailing list and a few dozen actually retaliated too, but NONE could refute my facts, and only one tried to reason from Scripture by saying that I was sowing discord among the brethren which the Lord hates. But I am just the messenger. It is Rick Warren who has sown discord among the brethren by attacking them as resisters and removing them from church after church through his training…a true devourer of the Lord’s sheep! And of course, NONE of them repented!

My initial appeal and letter entitled:

Response to SBC President Frank S. Page’s “Better Together” & Rick Warren’s Global Peace Plan vs. Scripture

which generated his response is now posted at: http://lightingtheway.blogspot.com/search?q=Sundquist

Sincerely in Christ,

James Sundquist
Director
Rock Salt Publishing

P.S. In the event that you may not believe my report, I invite you to contact Pastor Bob DeWaay, Twin City Fellowship in Minneapolis, who will corroborate my testimony regarding Rick Warren. He has also written a book on his teachings. You can reach him at:

Twin City Fellowship
2734 Rhode Island Ave. S.
St. Louis Park, MN
(Corner of W 28th St. & Rhode Island Ave. S.)
For further information, please call 952-935-3100.
********

November 7, 2007

SUBJECT: JAMES SUNDQUIST RESPONSE TO FRANK PAGE, PRESIDENT OF THE SOUTHERN BAPTIST CONVENTION & PASTOR OF TAYLORS BAPTIST CHURCH

I am in receipt of SBC President Frank Page’s your letter regarding my appeal to him, his staff and members of his congregation. Here is his letter:

Sent: Monday, November 05, 2007 12:10 PM

Subject: RE: Second request re Florida Baptist Convention

Dear James,

I will preach the Gospel at the Fla meeting. I will not be attacking other believers. Please do not send any more of your material to my staff or to me.

In Christ,

Frank Page

I send all emails expecting that, as a matter of courtesy, the recipients would ask my permission before sharing them with others. I hope you will honor this request, and if you received this email in error, that you would let me know, deleting your copy of it.

Here is my response.

First of all I would like to compare this response to his own historical statement:

“Southern Baptist Convention president Frank Page said Tuesday the denomination needs to set aside internal differences and be both “right and relevant” to revive languishing membership trends. When we speak the truth without love, it leads to a cold-hearted legalism that our world has come to say is the caricature of […]” SOURCE: http://christianresearchnetwork.com/index.php?s=missional

So by his own definition, Dr. Frank Page’s response to me is “cold-hearted legalism”…in speaking what he believes to be true…[I am not conceding that Dr. Page is even telling the truth by implying that I am bearing false witness against him and Rick Warren because I am attacking a brother.] If this is love, I sure hope I am not around when he doesn’t speak the truth in love, assuming he even allows his members to hear the truth, since he bars them from hearing from me. Forbidding his staff from hearing the cries and SOS calls from SBC victims…this is love? Any reasonable person would construe “attacking” as implied slander NOT legitimate correction or rebuking a brother.

Now let us compare Dr. Frank Page’s response to me with these Scriptures:

“And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all [men], apt to teach, patient, in meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth; And [that] they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.” II Timothy 2:24-26

I must also ask how Dr. Frank Pages’ response obeys these Scriptures:

“Show proper respect to everyone” I Peter 2:17

“When they hurled their insults at him, he did not retaliate.” I Peter 2:23

“Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect.” I Peter 3:15

and

“Brothers, do not slander one another” James 4:11

“But now you must rid yourselves of all such things as these: anger, rage, malice, slander, and filthy language from your lips.” Colossians 3:1

“Get rid of all bitterness, rage and anger, brawling, and slander, along with every form of malice.”

“Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there remember est that thy brother hath ought against thee; Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift.” Matthew 5:23-24

I am desperate to know if there is ever any situation in which these people think that correcting, opposing, rebuking, rebuking sharply, reproving, warning, silencing voices which ruin whole households, entreating, bringing an accusation against an elder with two or more witnesses, taking a brother before the entire church, turning a brother over to Satan, calling for repentance, admonishing, warning, appealing, expelling, exposing those who shipwreck the faith of many, which are all verbs the Apostle Paul used, is NOT “attacking other believers” , but actually helping them and the church? Is there one person that this was done to in which they believed the action helped the person vs. destroying them as they allege? I am not slandering Rick Warren if I am telling the truth about him…comparing his own published words with Scripture. But for me to remain silent in face of his published teachings , I would be harming him as well as those he teaches to follow him. It is the Lord alone I must fear. Rick Warren is also harming himself by resisting correction and not amending his published teachings.

Now much of this assumes that Rick Warren is even a brother. No man can know whether or not he is with certainty. But we can and must treat him as though he were not a brother, based on Paul’s own commands to the church:

Tts 3:10 A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject;

Gal 1:6 I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:

Gal 1:7 Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.

Gal 1:8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.

Gal 1:9 As we said before, so say I now again, If any [man] preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

1 Corinthians 5:11 “You must not associate with anyone who calls himself a brother, but is sexually immoral, or greedy, an idolater or a slanderer, a drunkard or a swindler.”

and the Apostle John’s warning:

1JO 4:1 Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world.

1JO 4:2 By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God;

1JO 4:3 and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God; and this is the spirit of the antichrist, of which you have heard that it is coming, and now it is already in the world.

1JO 4:4 You are from God, little children, and have overcome them; because greater is He who is in you than he who is in the world.

1JO 4:5 They are from the world; therefore they speak as from the world, and the world listens to them.

Those verses right there should be all any pastor needs to know to discern that the Purpose Driven movement is not from God.

Dr. Frank Page has asked that I refrain from further writing him or any of the staff of Taylors First Baptist Church. I will honor the request to not directly write him, for I have fulfilled my biblical obligation to appeal and to warn him twice. But I will can not comply with his request to cease from writing the staff members listed on Taylors First Baptist Church or the members of his congregation. I will also continue to alert the Southern Baptist Church at large and the various discernment ministries and Christian radio programs throughout the world, unless they specifically asked to be removed from my mailings. It is obvious from his letter that he is trying to intimidate me, which is quite common among Purpose Driven Pastors. Unless Dr. Frank Page prohibited them for speaking for themselves, I will let them speak for themselves, if this is their request…they have but to email me with a request to be removed from my mailing list, and I will happily comply. This will also serve to verify their solidarity with him, if this be the case. Let their yeas be yea and their nays nay. Dr. Page may have the power to stop his congregation from engaging in reciprocal dialog, but he does not have the biblical mandate to prevent this. It should be obvious to everyone what Pastor President Frank Page does not want [members of his own congregation] to hear. Do members of Taylors First Baptist Church want their pastor telling them with whom they can and can’t correspond? One can’t help but wonder why Dr. Frank Page doesn’t attempt censor my communications with pastors, staff, and members of the entire Southern Baptist Convention. If he is so against “attacking other believers” why does he continue to promote Rick Warren who attacks other Christians by calling Fundamentalist Christians “enemies of the 21st Century”? Rick Warren more than attacks other believers…he removes them if they oppose or resist is global agenda and bars them from membership if they refuse to sign his many covenants. And if Dr. Page believes in this so strongly, why does he use incendiary language such as “attack a believer” in retaliating against me vs. respond and answering my questions? How about Dr. Frank Page saying something like:

“Wow, this is very serious, thank you for bringing it to my attention! I will make every effort to let their voices be heard instead of silencing them, for I know that even in the secular world, victims of a crime are allowed to make a victim’s statement in a courtroom. I will be sure that some of them are allowed to speak and invite them myself to the platform if I have to! I can’t very well make an announcement to SBC brothers and sisters that we are “better together”, then fail to follow through with the offer, rendering it a sham and bringing further humiliation on victims of our campaign to enforce compliance with Purpose Driven teachings and covenants. What a hypocrite I would be if I were to now treat them as illegal aliens in the Body of Christ. But I should have no trouble doing this act of contrition and restitution because I am President of the entire Southern Baptist Convention, and I certainly have the moral authority to do so! And it is imperative that I extend this olive branch!”

Did the Apostle Paul “attack” Peter, because he was clearly in the wrong, or was he doing what he the Bible teaches and that is expose false teachings and marking them if they don’t repent? Paul was sharply rebuking and doing so publicly, as I am do so with him, as this is public matter.

Dr. Page’s response is no surprise…totally unrepentant and zero compassion for PDC victims and absolutely now indication whatsoever that he would even entertain or give any audience to Christians who are simply trying to be good Bereans.. Therefore, I will not honor his request regarding sharing his email with others (unless this were a private matter which I would of course respect confidentiality and disclaimers). This is a matter of public teaching requiring public rebuke.

Dr. Page could have used a little more grace, even if Dr. Page disagrees and wishes to defend Rick Warren’s teachings. And even if I oppose him, Paul has specific instructions and procedures on how to deal with even opposition which does not even remotely resemble his response to me. For Dr. Page to react like emotional nitroglycerin does not remind me of the fruit of the spirit of self-control. His response would hardly constitute anything resembling “come, let us reason” as the Apostle Paul tells us. It is perfectly responsible for Christians to engage in an honest dialog about the dangers of PDL. Is Dr. Page suggesting Christians can’t send an unsolicited email to another Christian, or even a church that claims its teachings are Christian which they have already publicly posted on their own church website? If this is true. Martin Luther had no business posting his “unsolicited” 95 Theses on the Wittenberg Door. Paul spent most of his ministry preaching to “unsolicited” and even hostile audiences. Besides this, the leaders of Dr. Page’s church post various groups have virtually placed a banner on their site advertising themselves, with name and email addresses. So this tells me that they are willing to receive inquiries and commentary regarding Rick Warren. Is Dr. Page telling me that they are only interested in receiving emails that toe the party line and are in complete agreement with the teachings they promote? If this is his position, he should put that disclaimer by every email address, because someone else at some point is bound to also send an email letter of concern to them….only to get blasted or have their email ignored. And it is not as though Dr. Frank Page has not already been confronted. Other Christian brothers and Pastor Ken Silva at Apprising Ministries has confronted him too, beginning in 2006, but still he refuses correction:

http://hottubreligion.wordpress.com/2007/05/25/apprising-ministriesken-silva/

http://www.apprising.org/archives/2007/01/letter_to_south.html

He has also now despised even reaching out to the victims of Purpose Driven Teachings. What a great opportunity lost to reconcile with these saints that Rick Warren’s training has purpose-driven out of churches all over the world at the Florida Baptist Convention and other SBC venues where he speaks. Though he has given lip service and a form of godliness in publicly stating that Southern Baptists are “Better Together,” his defiance speaks in his email speaks volumes. For those of you attending the Florida Baptist Convention, why don’t one of you call his hand and stand up and ask him to give disposed SBC members the mike and platform? What kind of Christian witness is it prevent the Southern Baptist attendees to hear the other side of the story? Dr. Page even acknowledges that there are factions of SBC out there who will not even talk to each other. Then Dr. Page sets a fine example by becoming one of these very people by refusing to talk to me. I too have witnessed first hand the divisions in the church when I spoke at the East Coast Prophecy Conference a in 2004. Since then the emails continue to roll in from PDC victims all over the world. I personally spoke with God-fearing members from churches all over the country come up to me in despair at the same kind of response by Dr. Frank Page issued to me, that they were getting at Rick Warren’s PDL churches for questioning his teachings and the churches implementing his programs, only to be vilified and marked as trouble makers, and in many cases ousted from their congregations. And these very same SOS calls are flooding into many other ministries too such as Southwest Radio, Pastor Bob DeWaay, Moriel Ministries, and Contending Earnestly for The Faith in Australia and many others I mentioned in my recent letter to Dr. Page. But I had thought better of Dr. Frank Page, particularly after his recent “Better Together” statements. But I was wrong.

Does Ephesians say “expose the deeds of darkness” unless the perpetrator wrote a disclaimer on his plans or sent it to someone confidentially and did not give permission?

Therefore, I will not honor his request regarding his staff. What is he trying to hide from them? Wouldn’t his staff want to know? Shouldn’t his staff, deacons and members know…unless they are also accomplices? Let them make such a request…unless pastor is master and thought control censors any ability on their part to answer for themselves. If these staff members post their email address and are prevented by him from responding unless it promotes the party line, then they should say so and make it clear on the website. Dr. Page may have already told his staff not to respond to me, but there were no carbon copies and I have no way of knowing if there were any blind carbon copies he may have sent them or simply told them privately. In any case, if I were on staff or a member of Taylors First Baptist Church, I would certainly want to know who the pastor is interfering with to allow correspondence from another believer who is inquiring at their own published website. I would certainly want to know who a pastor told me I could not communicate with if I were a member of his church. Are the members of Taylors First Baptist Church Pastor Frank Page’s own private supply of royal jelly? Does he own their free will? Is he claiming to speak for them? Is he now their conscience? More frightening is the implication that he is acting as the Holy Spirit for his members, thereby usurping the Office of the Holy Spirit. Is this his church? His staff? Or Jesus Christ’s church? The Apostle Paul even welcomed the opposition to debate, as did Apollos. But Dr. Page’s idea of “Better Together” is to by all means silence the opposition and answer NONE of the legitimate concerns or appeals presented to him and make no space for them at SBC conventions and events. Give them no audience, as is most clearly about to transpire at the Florida Baptist Convention. If he is accusing me of bearing false witness against him or Rick Warren, then he must prove it. He has not done so, but, as usual with most PDC pastors, he simply retaliates and censors me. If my accusations are false, I appeal to his congregation members to confront him to document where and give specifics…unless he doesn’t believe the Apostle Paul, who said you must have them if you are going to make charges.

I always hope all things…that if he or any Christian states they want to reconcile (“better together”), then I want to give them every opportunity to follow through. In this case, Dr. Page has only verified and confirmed our suspicions and accusations. His philosophy collides with the Apostle Paul’s’ own instructions and model of behavior regarding confronting brothers in Christ and exposing false brethren.

I am biblically commanded to only warn him twice…that is unless he repents, particularly since he professes to be a teacher [pastor] of God’s Word, according his own church website. Was the Apostle Paul “attacking a believer” when he confronted Peter, Alexander the Blacksmith, Hymenaus and Philetus, and the Pharisees in Galatians? Was the Jude “attacking a believer”? Was the Apostle John “attacking a believer” in confronting Diotrephes, who was doing exactly what Rick Warren is doing? My defense and accusations are based on objective criteria of Scripture. His defense is based on his own subjective ad homimim attack on me personally. What kind of criteria is that? He is convicted by his own testimony and by what he is promoting at his own church. The Apostle Paul always preached repentance and Christ crucified in synagogues, always proselytizing…diametrically opposed to what Rick Warren did when he spoke at Synagogue 3000 and even declared to them that he was not trying to convert them. He is just trying to help the grow bigger and better synagogues…i.e. grow the false religion of Judaism. And once again what did Paul do regarding Judaizers, he condemned them in Galatians, the opposite of what Rick Warren has done. And this does not make him a false teacher that the President of the Southern Baptist Convention should not expose? You don’t think the Apostle Paul would have sharply rebuked Rick Warren for this kind of public teaching? He could not have remained silent in good conscience, but Dr. Page says nothing because that would be “attacking a believer”. And if that weren’t enough, Rick Warren is doing the same with Mormons and Roman Catholics.

Dr. Page remains silent about Rick Warren while Rick Warren votes for the New Ager August Turak who won the Power of Purpose Award because to speak out would be “attacking a believer”…Rick Warren has reinvited New Age sympathizer Ken Blanchard to preach at his church whom I exposed in my second book on Rick Warren and Mr. Frank Page remains silent so as to not be “attacking a believer”. Rick Warren purpose-drives them out of the church and trains 400,000 pastors globally how to do it, and this without cause or the due process of church discipline outlined in Scripture in which these brothers and sisters must be found guilty of heresy first, while Dr. Frank Page remains silent because that would be “attacking a believer”. But those who oppose Warren, however, do have just cause to remove him from the church. And as the Apostle Paul would say, “I am now therefore the enemy because I tell you the truth?” And what do you think Peter would think of all of the believers gathered a Pentecost singing a song like Jimmi Hendrix’ Purple Haze, as Rick Warren led the multitudes in the stadium where he launched his Global Peace Plan? While Frank Page remains silent because that would be “attacking a believer”. Dr. Page, may remain silent, but you don’t have to.

In order for the SBC Florida Conference theme to be considered anything other than a sham, Willie Rice and Dr. Frank Page, President of the Florida Baptist Convention must invite SBC victims such as Mrs. Betty Erwin or Charles Jones of Iuka Baptist Church. They need to also invite an author of an opposing view to Rick Warren’s teachings, as a speaker, which to my knowledge has never happened at any SBC church in the country. I hope you will not be fooled by these apostate leaders, masquerading as servants of righteousness.

Therefore, I remind Dr. Frank Page, SBC President, Pastor Willie Rice, Pastor Mac Brunson, and Rick Warren, and will warn others about these men according to these Scriptures:

“Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there remember est that thy brother hath ought against thee; Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift.” Matthew 5:23-24

Isa 5:20 Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

Rom 1:25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

“For without [are] dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.” Revelation 22:15

So SBC President and Pastor Frank Page can remain silent and do what he must do. But I will not be silenced, I will do what I must do. I hope and pray that you will not be afraid of these men, but rather fear the Lord, and not be silenced either, but will hold him accountable!

Sincerely in Christ,

James Sundquist Rock Salt Publishing http://www.abrahamic-faith.com/False-Teachers.html

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13 Responses to “Abrahamic Faith Continues The Battle Against Rick Warren Purpose Driven Apostasy In Southern Baptist Convention”

  1. Esther said

    I’m so glad to see you continue to stand up against the fast-growing apostasy in the SBC. People do not want to see so they hide their heads in the sand. Your book about Purpose Dirven was excellent. I’ve passed it on, but have never received a comment about it (or the book back)! Keep up the good work…God bless you.

  2. Esther: I should mention that I am not James Sundquist. He can be reached at

  3. Great Commission Unity said

    As I understand the term apostasy, it is related to perversions of the gospel and turning away from Faith in Christ. Though I’m sure these words will fall on deaf ears, the gospel of Christ is to be at the heart of all that we do. Granted Rick Warren isn’t perfect and some have made mistakes following his book. However, I doubt that you would crucify Luther or Calvin for all the people who have done grievous things in their names. Frank Page is a man of God with a vision for seeing Christ glorified and the gospel preached in a church that is not unneccesarily offensive to either seekers, new believers, or traditionalists. Despite what you think you know about him, he is a man of great compassion who seeks unity within his own congregation and among the SBC for the sake of the gospel. If that is a sin, I could only wish to be guilty of the same sin as I stand before my Savior. It is the Pharisees and legalistic self righteous traditionalists that Christ rebuked. However, he reached out to the tax collector, the prostitute, and those who showed such people love and forgiveness. If you say keep the gospel pure, I can only cry a firm amen. However, if you set yourself as the judge and jury for all believers and all churches, then I can only humbly ask that you return to the cross and the heart of a Savior who came not to condemn the world but to offer grace and forgiveness.

  4. Great Commission Unity:

    I am shocked that so many Christians charge each other with being Pharisees and legalists.

    1. Pharisees rejected the deity of Jesus Christ. Fundamentalist, traditionalist, and evangelical Christians, by nature, do not meet that definition. However, many of the liberal and emergent elements working within the Southern Baptist Convention do. Further, the liberals and emergents do just as much accusing and judging of the fundamentalist Christians as anyone else, if not more. It is just that when the emergents and liberals do it, no one calls it fingerpointing, judging, and accusations.

    2. Legalists, or Judaizers, are those who taught salvation by works. Again, fundamentalist, traditionalist, and evangelical Protestant and Reformed Christians, by nature, do not meet that definition. However, the religion of a great many liberal and emergent elements working within the Southern Baptist Convention base their spirituality almost entirely on doing good works, and raise the bony finger of accusation against Christians that do not share their passion for the social gospel, which is a whole lot of social and very little gospel.

    3. Apart from rejecting Jesus Christ and grace, the primary error of the legalists and Pharisees was perverting, usurping, or replacing the Word of God with the doctrines of man. If your case that such is being done here by the opponents of Page and Warren, make it. Otherwise, you are siding with emergent and liberal teachers that claim that the Bible isn’t authoritative and that Christianity needs to be augmented with abominations from false religions. Now why is it that when the emergents and liberals teach the doctrines of man as if they were commandments of God, no one calls THEM legalists and Pharisees?

    No, it is only the people that oppose sin that the Bible condemns that get called legalists and Pharisees. Paul opposed sin. Was he a legalist or a Pharisee? It is only the pople that demand doctrinal purity that get called legalists and Pharisees. John demanded doctrinal purity. Was he a legalist or a Pharisee? You can ask the same question of Jude, James, Peter, or any of the other New Testament writers. Who among them were legalists and Pharisees? It had to have been Paul, who said that false preachers had a reprobate mind. Or certainly Jude, who spoke against using the grace of God for lasciviousness. Or maybe it was Jude, who spoke against showing favor to the rich! Well how can we avoid showing preference to the rich if so many of these megapreachers are wealthy and hobnob with corporate and political leaders? Why are so many members of the Southern Baptist hierarchy trying to form connections with the various presidential candidates? And why does Rick Warren have lucrative book deals with Rupert Murdoch, the biggest purveyor of violent, misogynistic, pornographic, racist, and hatred for the poor evil that passes for entertainment in the world? Conservatives dislike Larry Flynt because Jerry Falwell took him on and lost and because he helped Bill Clinton during that impeachment trial, but Rupert Murdoch has much more power and many more paying customers than Flynt could have ever dreamed of!

    I am not setting myself as the judge and jury of all churches. Nay, I am saying that the Bible is. Have you not read Revelation 2 and 3? Do you honestly think that it does not apply to you? Churches that do not even try to conform themselves to scripture will be the very first to taste the wrath of God. God will not go easy on you just because you sit in church and call yourself a Christian. Quite the contrary, judgment starts in the church!

    I am not doing this for money. I am not doing this to try to control you and gain power. I am doing this because you have an eternal soul, and even if you aren’t concerned about its fate I have to be. Thank you and may God bless you.

  5. This is sad, the head of the SBC is trying to take that whole denomination for a big numbers run with Rick Warren. It’s apparent the work MUST CONTINUE to show that Rick Warren is offering a false gospel.

    I hear that Rick does not copyright any of his material. So it sounds like it’s past due that more of us start capturing and exposing what Warren is up to, using his own statements from video footage of him.

    Rick’s a soft spoken ear tickler, who leaves followers of his on the broad road.

  6. johnkaniecki said

    Healtheland,

    Greetings my brother and friend in the name of our Lord and savious Jesus. Let me add to your fine and well spoken words.

    Greatcommission Unity,

    Greetings Brother in the name of Jesus our Lord and saviour. I am so delighted that you have written your words. I like your name but it’s not your real name. I pray one day you will have the courage to give your full name. I respect your wisdom though. I know there is a time and a season for everything I pray one day you will recognize the time. Recall how the walls of Jericho fell my friend. The trumpet was blown and everybody shouted. So shall Satan’s walls crumble, all his defenses will be gone.

    There is nothing wrong about being offensive. Christ is describe as a stumbling block and an offense. I Peter 2:8. Jesus is a “rock of offense”. Yes we would like to be gentle, it is a fruit of the spirit. I like how you say “unecessarily offensive”. But who is to judge what is necessary or not? Not you nor I but the Lord. Galatians 5:22 “But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.” Gentleness is something we strive to have but it is secondary to Love. Note the order Paul lists these virtues. Love and compassion isn’t the same as keeping the peace though. “Think not that I am come to send peace on Earth: I come not to send peace but a sword.” Jesus is referring to the Sword of the Spirit. Ephesians 6:17 “…and the Sword of the Spirit, which is the Word of God.” READ THIS IN THIS CONTEXT, I AM DISGUSTED WITH CHRISTIANS WHO JUST WANT TO KEEP PEACE, LET US BE ABOUT OUR SPIRITUAL WAR. UNITY IS GREAT IF WERE ALL DOING THE LORD’S WORK. BUT UNITY FOR UNITY’S SAKE IS AN EVIL. I DON’T WANT TO HANG AROUND AND BE UNIFIED WITH PIGS. IF ALL THE SHEEP COULD GET TOGETHER WITHOUT PIGS AND WOLVES THEN YES BE UNITED THEN.SICK SOME OF THEM DOGS ON THOSE WOLVES. DOGS ARE MEANT TO PROTECT THE SHEEP,THAT IS THERE PURPOSE. DON’T COMPROMISE YOUR CHRISTIAN CONVICTIONS FOR UNITIES SAKE. I BEG YOU FOR THE SAKE OF GOD. STAND STRONG IN THE WORD OF GOD. SPEAK WHAT IS RIGHT AND TRUE. (sorry if I shout) You may not want to overturn the apple cart but if you do the apples will roll all over the place. Some may rot in the street but hundreds of apple trees will find the soil and grow.

    Mathew 10:16 “I am sending you out like sheep among wolves. Therefore be as shrewd as snakes and as innocent as doves.” Mathew 10:34 (Sometimes I just like to keep scripture in.)

    Greatcommission Unity. Please allow me to make a few more comments.

    If you want to have an impact on this Christian blog use some scriptures quotations because that is what Christians on this blog recognize. You use many Biblical terms and words correctly and wisely in my opinion. Healtheland would respond to particular verses. Quote them for him. If you love him you will take the time to do so. It’s what he understands best.

    Secondly I suggest you point out the good things that Healtheland has done. He isn’t all good nor all bad and neither are you. As a brother or sister in Christ encourage, uplift, see the good in this zealous, hard working, dedicated man.

    I hope you read Healthelands response though. I find these words fine words. Remember the apostle John who was a Son of Thunder before he was the Disciple of Love.

    Also, there is no problem with questioning others. Some of the Lord’s best teachings came as a response to questions. God doesn’t get angry if we question him. Jesus wouldn’t have told Healtheland, please don’t write me anymore. That is my humble testimony brother GreatcommissionUnity. Your entitled to your opinion and I am perfectly willing to let the Lord Jesus judge, that is His job after all. Not yours nor mine, nor Healtheland. Healtheland isn’t judging anyone he’s raising questions about things he feels that others are violating scripture. In fact he goes back to the Bible to make his point.

    James 3:1 “Not many of you should presume to be teachers, my brothers, because you know that we who teach will be judged more strictly.”

    Let me confess that if I hadn’t taken the time to reread your comments this blog entry would have been very different. There are some devils on the blog who twist, pervert and attack, I don’t think your one. I find your words full of grace and wisdom as I contemplate them more. But in my humble opinion you are missing something very important. It isn’t anything goes. Christians should go by the Word.

    I’d like to know if you know Frank Page personally. Than you’d be qualified to be a witness. Please share you experiences, that would be helpful.

    I understand better now how the Wheat and Tares grow up together. I see also that when you discover one devil hanging around you start to look for more devils. Pray for me that I keep my eyes focussed on Jesus and that I may be humble. I have so much to learn and so little time. It is always have been my greatest fear that I wouldn’t be ready for the task I must do when the time comes. Early in my life the realization of my purpose paralyzed me. The call of all Christians is to serve Jesus and the is an awesome responsibility. I have studied, prayed, suffered and made many mistakes along the way. I have hurt others and sinned and I am sorry for that.

    To lighten things up. “You couldn’t walk in my shoes because I walk bearfoot.” I mean without shoes.

    Love,

    John

    Forgive that these words aren’t perfect.

  7. Eden Hadassah said

    I am pretty sure…yeah, 😉 I’m sure that one of the commandments is to “Honor your father and mother!” If God is our father, should we not also honor him? Even above our earthly father? If this is true, look up the word “Honor” and see the dictionary’s definition of this word. You will find that the very first word which defines honor is honesty.
    Peace and unity can not come by denying the truth and being honest. We must not turn our backs on the truth for the sake of solidarity. To do so is to put emnity between us and God. So while “brethren” may think that they are unified, all they are unified in is creating a division between themselves collectively and God.
    I will honor both God and man by being honest.

  8. John said

    What a hoot. This whole letter reads of narcissism and paranoia. No wonder these guys asked you to quit sending them stuff in the mail. It’s called “junk mail”.

  9. John said

    I’m sure do to “moderation” I will probably be “censored” as Sundquist cries about but there are so many factual errors in his screed to render the whole thing comical.

    1. Did Sundquist retain the permission of Page to reprint his email publicly as requested?

    2. I do not see any “retaliation” from Page. He simply asked not to send any more info to him, his staff, or church. That’s retaliation?

    3. Do you think there is a good reason that “hundreds of SBC pastors” did not answer Sundquist’s SOS emails? And it just might not be that they are all apostates, liberals, or in bed with Warren. Most probably assume he is a crackpot.

    4. Sundquist has the the temerity to tell Page he needs to show HIM more grace….while he incites people at a public meeting to stand up and DEMAND the floor to air their grievances publicly and out of order……not to mention the lack of grace he shows Warren as will be shown shortly.

    5. Warren does not have any “PDL churches”. There are churches that have used methods he ascribes in his PDC book and PDL book but they are not “Warren’s churches”. What the pastors decide to do in the local church body are there decision and Warren has nothing to do with those choices….or the manner in which they decide to carry out his advice.

    6. One does not lose membership at Warrens’ Saddleback church for “failing to sign covenants”. In truth, one does not receive membership until attends a 4 hour class teaching about the history of the church and the beleifs of the church and he signs a membership covenenat. It’s nothing secret nor nefarious. A copy can easily be retained. Church number is 949-609-8000. I worked on the Memebership team there and no of where I speak. There are no other covenenants to continually sign to keep one’s membership in good standing.

    7. Mormons have never been invited to come or have ever been knowingly allowed at a PDC conference. This was an error written in the March 2004 edition of the USAToday by a writer who admitted she wrote it herself mistakenly that Mormons were a Christian denomination. A look at the article will show there were no quotes around the words in question.

    8. Ken Blanchard is not a new ager but has in his Christian infancy confused about some issues pertaining to such. He has grown in that area with help of discipling older Christians. He was never invited to “preach at Saddleback” a first time or a second time. Rather, he gave a testimony one time of his house burning in the recent San Diego fires and how it belonged to God anyhow and how he was glad it was his and not his sons home.

    9. Warren never “led the congregation in the song Purple Haze at the 25th anniversary of the church”. I was there. This has morphed from Rick singing three bars of the song to singing the whole song to now leading the “congregation in the song”. Truth is he jokingly sang the first three bars…as a joke.

    So while Sundquist is calling others on the carpet for “integrity” I think he better start by looking in his own back yard. When he knowingly skirts the truth, even distorts the truth, one can only wonder how much more error he has printed in his books.

  10. Michael Godwin said

    Unbelievable. I am a part of the SBC..
    I read above what I feared most..Someone
    defending Rick Warren and Frank Page.
    “Great Community Unity”. To reply to what this, I suppose, fellow member of the SBC wrote:
    Jesus didn’t come to condemn the world..because..it is ALREADY condemned. He came to SAVE you and me. What Mercy and What love! He did make us all. He knows what it takes to keep us from eternal damnation. That is the UNITY we need to keep in focus. Not Rick Warren telling us that God has a purpose for us.. Hell’s Angels get members ..because people are looking for a “purpose in life”. Love Jesus for his Shed Blood! yes..he does love us…But…he also warns us about babies sucking on their mothers breasts etc. in the end of times..I am not advocating when that will be…but it does sound like God has a purpose for the believers and unbelievers!
    Should we first be telling people this?
    Not wasting our time defending Rick Warren and Frank Page? God asks us to discern and I don’t agree with Rick’s nor Frank’s methods of bringing people into the fold!

  11. Nanc said

    Thanks for sharing this. I agree with what you did, and it shows us how big this apostate church has become. We just have to remember GREATER is CHRIST IN US, then he that is in the world..and put the WHOLE ARMOUR of GOD on. But, had you not shared this….many people would continue to support Mr. Huckabee for President (I am NOT now) – and many would be deceived into the apostate church. God bless you for this. 🙂

  12. Dear Brother James, GREETINGS IN JESUS PRECIOUS NAME!!!”I JUST SENT YOU E-MAIL ON THE ABRAHAMIC SITE. We HAVE NOT SPOKEN, FELLOWSHIPPED & PRAYED OVER THE PHONE FOR SOME TIME. WHAT PROMPTED THIS E-MAIL IS THE NEW AND LENTHY ARTICLE(COVER STORY) IN NEWSWEEK ON THE “REV” RICK WARREN.
    THIS GUY IS MUCH MORE DANGEROUS THAT I NEW!!!!!!IN ADDITION AS I MENTIONED TO YOU DURING OUT LAST PHONE CONVERSATION THE DESIRE TO DISCUESS THE STATE MY OWN SPIRITUALITY. THEN SOME TIME IN THE FUTURE, LORD WILLING, MY WIFE’S SPIRITUALITY.
    James it has been a joy to have called you a friend from 1979!
    JAMES, YOU AND KAREN HAVE BEEN GREAT FRIENGS OVER THE YEARS.
    2CORINTHIANS 2:14-17 call @ 973.534.3435 or home# 610.814.4848

  13. Pastor Donald Killey said

    I wish I would have heard from you on the issues of Rick Warren
    because I’m a SBC pastor but in total disagreement with Warren.
    As a pastor of a SBC church we will in the very near months be steping away from the SBC because of the amount of apostasy with in the conventions and the schools as well. And who they as well are in agreement with such as Warren.

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