Jesus Christ Is Lord

That every knee should bow and every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God the Father!

Paula White Claims That Jesus Christ Died In Vain!

Posted by Job on September 2, 2007

Out of all the disgusting, revolting false doctrine scams to raise money there is out there, the Paula White scam below is the absolute worst. What is it? The “atonement offering.” What was the atonement offering? Payment for our sins under Judaism. But Jesus Christ died for our sins once and forever! There is NOTHING that we can do to add to what Jesus Christ did on the cross. But by promoting the notion of an “atonement offering” which will cause God to bless you because it will make you more holy and righteous and acceptable in the eyes of God, Paula White makes the sacrifice of Jesus Christ on the cross, nay the entire life and resurrection of Jesus Christ, null and void. According to this abomination of White’s, there is no Christianity. We are still living under the Old Covenant, because according to this nonsense there is an atonement offering other than Jesus Christ. Despite the Bible saying: Romans 5:11: And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement. The Bible makes it clear: Jesus Christ is our only acceptable sin offering. If Paula White actually cared about the Jewish roots of the Christian faith, she would be talking about how the sacrifices, the feasts, the statues and art in the tabernacle and temple, etc. pointed to Jesus Christ. She would be talking about how pagan “Easter” is actually the Jewish Passover and how Jesus Christ was more likely born on (guess what!) the Day of Atonement than December 25. But she is not going to do that, because she is not interested in Christ or His people (see It Is OK To Celebrate Christmas). All Paula White wants is your money! Can’t you people see that?

You do realize that there is no turning back after an abomination like this? A person who calls himself or herself a preacher who does things like this is an apostate, a blasphemer, a heretic because they are denying the very Name and Way by which we are saved; they are denying the very deity of Jesus Christ and righteousness of God! These people are REPROBATES! WHY ARE YOU FOLLOWING THEM? I will give you the answer … either because you are deceived or because you are reprobates like they are. Which is it? Well, if you are reading this, then you are no longer deceived. If you read this and still follow them, then you are a reprobate on your way to an eternity in the lake of fire. And that is your problem – and White’s problem – not mine. Please see the link below where I received this information.

Paula White’s Atonement Offering is Bull and Has Gotten My Goat

holycow.jpg

My thanks to Brother Rod for his creation of this title as I am not as good with words. Yet my words about this abomination that Paula has put on her website has nearly left me speechless. The Atonement Offering is not made for believers! It is found in Leviticus 16 and was never meant for money. Is she asking her followers to send her live animals such as the bull, goat, sheep, and ram instead? What can she be thinking?

Christ made atonement for our sins once on the cross! This money business is really getting out of hand. Prayer cloths, holy water, and now an Atonement Offering? Don’t these people ever take God at His word? “You CANNOT serve God and mammon” Matthew 6:24. What part of “cannot” does Paula not comprehend? “Your money perish with you, because you thought that the gift of God could be purchased with money! You have neither part nor portion in this matter, for your heart is not right in the sight of God. Repent, therefore, of this WICKEDNESS, and pray God, if perhaps the thought of your heart may be forgiven you” Acts 8:20-22.

Paula White does appear beautiful on the outside but Jesus would not care for her insides very much. “You are like whitewashed tombs which indeed appear beautiful outwardly BUT INSIDE ARE FULL OF ALL MEN’S DEAD BONES AND ALL UNCLEANNESS. Even so, you outwardly appear righteous to men, BUT INSIDE YOU ARE FULL OF HYPOCRISY AND LAWLESSNESS” Matthew 23:27-28.

By the way, if you click onto that picture to send her money it will do nothing as our ministry does not support making merchandise out of you!

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118 Responses to “Paula White Claims That Jesus Christ Died In Vain!”

  1. Oh my!!! These heretics are really letting loose all the stops in 2007!

  2. endtimespropheticwords said

    They get worse and worse every day that goes by. Were will it end? Oh yeah, I know. Revelation and the Book of Daniel gives us a few hints.

    • Acordial greetings in the name of our lord Jesus Christ.
      It gives me pleasure to write thisletter to you forthe first time since the lord called me to His service.
      We are preaching the gospel to our friends to know the real Jesus and His salvation to this lost world
      We prayed tothe lord to give us guidilines.
      Our prayer was to ask the lord to give us friends to help us in preaching the gospel.That is how the lord openedour eyes to you (ps.143:8)We request you to pray for us for the door to be opened.
      Also never forget to remember the destined kids in our ministry who need much of the lord’s hand and care through us who the has showed theway and theright direction towards His salvation.Glory be His name forever andever amen.
      Hope to hear from you soon,thanks.

  3. James said

    wow…just wow…I’ve been saying that a lot lately. An old preacher told me as a child that in end times the heretics and blasphemers will stand out like sore thumbs. That we’ll sit back scratching our heads wondering why so many are allowing themselves to be deceived. Nowhere on the pamphlet does it tal about praying or fasting…just sending an atonement offering? Wow Paula…you got a lot of nerve, sis.

  4. Terri King said

    For us that are “so called” the true Christians, why are we pointing our fingers and kicking a sister, brother or non-follower of Jesus Christ while they are down? Wouldn’t it be much better if we just Pray “God in spite of all the media coverage, internet blogs and or negative headlines may your will be done”, and allow God to be the Judge.

  5. Terri King: So, I am only supposed to care about myself and the false preacher? What about the people that are being deceived and misled by these false preachers? If I am to love my neighbor as myself and be my brother’s keeper, shouldn’t I be doing my job, which is to warn them about false preachers and false movements in the church? Why are you urging Christians to abandon their responsibilities to the Body of Christ? Put it this way: you believe in evangelism, right? If so, why? Why not just pray to God that people be saved and let God handle it? After all, God is the judge of who is saved and who isn’t, right? Some Calvinists even say that God is the judge of who will be saved and who won’t be saved! But no, you have no problem with me evangelizing, because my evangelizing is not exposing your favorite false preachers for what they are. Also, what if Paula White came out in favor of gay marriage and started marrying homosexuals in her church? Or started working as a chaplain in an abortion clinic? What would you do then? This is how hypocritical and abiblical people are being regarding this issue.

  6. Mike said

    As much as I understand that christians can be deceived, I find it hard to believe that people like Terri King actually exist. Maybe they are fake bloggers sent by Paula White and her ilk to spread their deceit.

  7. Mike: I wish it were the case, but it is not so. Just a short time ago, I myself was on the Internet defending these same people. Thank God that I did not have a blog back then.

  8. Sheryn Sept 2 2007 said

    If Paul or Peter were to hear Bynum,White
    Jakes,Olsten by the way whose Father
    preached the Word I dont know what happen
    to his Son ,they would rebuked them.
    Try the Spirit Oh Saints open your
    spiritual eyes and ears.Study your WORD so you know false doctrine when you
    hear it.My sheep hear my voice and none other will they follow GOD help us to
    hear your voice only not silver tongue
    devils

  9. berf said

    Am I wrong or is this not akin to the “indulgences” that the Roman Catholic Church introduced back in the 1500s??? And, if so, were they not the same “indulgences” that directly prompted Martin Luther to issue his 95 Theses, which, in turn, laid the groundwork for what would eventually become the Protestant Reformation??
    Perhaps we will all soon be hearing about someone new nailing 95 Theses to the door of the Castle Church Without Walls……Because, Lord knows, another Reformation is long overdue…..

  10. Stephen said

    I watched the shows about Sep.22 being The Dat of Atonement. What you are saying went on in the show is misleading!. Steve Muncey and Larry Huch taught the same thing, with variances. Huch taught on Atonement Day and other stuff like curses. It is about coming to Christ on that day not empty-handed. The old T Read it in Exodus. It says this is God’s day Forever and they made it clear on the show it was a ‘type’ and ‘shadow’ of the cross of Jesus. You can mislead the people who didn’t watch or just watched because of the scandal, but not the people who saw entire series. I am not saying her divorce is ok or not and you can’t either unless you know the inside story, which I see you don’t. And there were rich people in the Bible,too so don’t go there unless you know that was her sin. Maybe but I’m not gonna judge, but pray and wait for the entire story to surface,which it always does. Christian’s don’t read their Old Testament enough. These are types and shadows of Christ and the New Testament. Look up the Greek and Hebrew for Law. In the NT Law means Legalism. In the Old it means the moral,dietary, and other “laws’-check it out. The Blood of Jesus is what saves you but only “by grace,through faith” as the NT says.

  11. Stephen: I am named after three Old Testament books. I read the Old Testament all the time. I actually prefer it to the New Testament. The plan to salvation that I present to people is based on Isaiah 6. So now that you are through falsely accusing me, let me help you understand something.

    Judaism is dead. It died in 586 BC when the ark of the covenant was destroyed by the Babylonians. That is why when the second temple was built, Roman emperor Pompey did not die when he entered the Holy of Holies in 63 BC. Now in Ezekiel, the book that you accuse me of not having read, which happens to be my MIDDLE name, the prophet has a VISION of the spirit of God leaving the temple in Jerusalem and coming to Israel, which is where the people of God was. Do you know what that signified, Stephen? It signified that the old covenant was dead because Israel did not keep it. So, Israel was to wait on the NEW COVENANT, which was prophesied by Jeremiah, Joel, Ezekiel, Hosea, Isaiah, Moses, and the other Old Testament prophets that you falsely accuse me of being somehow unfamiliar with.

    So do you know what that means, sir? It means that the old covenant is DEAD. They are USELESS. They have no more spiritual value. There are NO blessings contained in them. The only thing that they are good for is STUDYING so we can USE them to LEARN how they reveal Jesus Christ and the nature of God.

    But now we have Jesus Christ, who a lot of people – including me – BELIEVE TO HAVE BEEN BORN ON THE DAY OF ATONEMENT, which the Jews call Yom Kippur. What you need to do is read HEBREWS. HEBREWS tells you how the Sabbath, the temple, the sacrifices, the feasts and observances, etc. HAVE ALREADY BEEN FULFILLED IN JESUS CHRIST, and that the NEW THING, JESUS CHRIST, IS INCOMPARABLY INDESCRIBABLY SUPERIOR TO THE OLD THING THAT HE REPLACED!

    Now if you are a Messianic Jew who wants to keep these things because you want to identify with your culture and nation and be better able to evangelize your Jewish brethren, that is fine. Paul himself said that it was OK for Jews to keep those things if they wanted to. If you are raised in something and it is very important to you and is your life and culture, you do not have to give it up if it is not a sin or a snare to you. Paul said that the law was not sinful because it was given by God, so there was no reason to require Jews to abandon it. That is why all of these Gentile Christians that bash Messianic Jews are so off – base.

    But you want to know who is more off base? Seeking blessings under the old covenant. Paul dedicated SO MUCH of the New Testament warning people against that, calling it sin and abomination, and calling people who did so reprobates and bewitched. And that is what is happening to you right now. You are being bewitched by these reprobates who will NEVER teach you what I am telling you right now, because the KNOWLEDGE of the TRUTH of what is ACTUALLY IN THE BIBLE will prevent them from financially exploiting PEOPLE LIKE YOU.

    Under the new covenant, giving money with expectation of receiving a blessing IS A SIN. And telling people that they have to give money or else they will be cursed IS A SIN. Don’t you realize that these doctrines make every doctrine that Jesus Christ taught in His gospels a lie? These LYING FALSE PREACHERS are sinners and turning good Christian people who are hurting and need some peace and hope into sinners. THAT is why I oppose them so. I do not care about Paula White and Randy White’s divorce. What they do to themselves and each other in their own lives is their business. But YOU, Steven, YOU are my business. I want YOU to come out from these lies that are corrupting your mind and turning your spirit as black.

    The Bible says that we are to give to support the work of the Lord because we want to see it done. We are to give because we love God and our neighbor. We are to give to legitimate ministries because we know that God is being glorified through them. We are to give to legitimate charities to feed the hungry, clothe the naked, comfort the widows, help those in prison, heal the sick, and lift up those in poverty. And also, we are to support legitimate evangelistic efforts because Jesus Christ said that He will not return until His gospel is preached throughout the world.

    And do you know why we are supposed to want Jesus Christ to come back? Because we are supposed to want the final defeat of Satan and all evil so that mankind and creation can be delivered from wickedness, pain, suffering, and corruption. We are supposed to want Jesus Christ to come back so that there will be no more wars, so that there will be no more drug addiction, so that there will be no more AIDS and diseases, so that babies will no longer starve to death, so that men and women and children will no longer be raped, molested, and mutilated. But you know what? The return of Jesus Christ is being hindered because good Christians like you are being deceived into supporting frauds like these. There are AT LEAST TWO BILLION PEOPLE THAT HAVE NEVER HEARD THE GOSPEL. THERE ARE AT LEAST 1500 LANGUAGES THAT THE BIBLE HAS NOT BEEN TRANSLATED INTO. AT CURRENT RATES, IT WILL TAKE OVER 100 YEARS TO TRANSLATE THE BIBLE INTO ALL OF THESE LANGUAGES, AND 200 YEARS TO REACH ALL OF THESE PEOPLE. UNLESS THINGS CHANGE, THE ONLY THING THAT MAY SPEED UP THE PROCESS ARE THESE PEOPLE AND LANGUAGES DYING OUT! But instead of supporting the Wycliffe Bible Society and Gideon International, these preachers are duping us into giving all of our money to them so they can buy mansions, jets, luxury cars, diamonds, furs, and get plastic surgery, and they corrupt and pervert Old Testament doctrine to get you to do it.

    Well, brother, I am here to tell you today: Jesus Christ is your prosperity. Keep the commandments of Jesus Christ and you go to heaven. The fruits of the Holy Spirit will give you joy, peace, happiness, knowledge, wisdom, patience, etc. to endure and overcome the trials and tribulations of this earth, and the fruits of the Holy Spirit will help you edify the Body of Christ. You know what? Old Testament Israel did not have those. They did not have the fruits of the Holy Spirit, so they just had to endure whatever sorrow, misery, and misfortune that came their way. And they did not have the gifts of the Spirit to edify the congregation, so they had to go out and have some priest kill a lamb or a dove or burn some barley cakes for them. And if the priests and rulers were wicked like the pagan idolator sons of Eli who raped the women who came to worship at the temple, and prevented the people from giving offerings? If those that were rich refused to forgive debts and give to the poor? Oh well, they just had to take it.

    So you see why you are under a new covenant with better promises, Stephen? If you do, then why are you whoring after the old? Jesus Christ is your Sabbath. Jesus Christ is your atonement. Jesus Christ is your firstfruits. Every old testament ponzi scheme produced by these false preachers who make money off Chrisitans like you because they are too dumb and lazy to go into the business world or politics and compete with the real criminals (a lot of these “pastors” do not even have the degrees that they claim, and Randy White is one of them) for the power and money the hard way. Stephen, the people deceiving you and ripping you off are doing so because they weren’t good enough to do it at Enron or in Congress. Sit back and ponder that for awhile, and then write your next check to http://www.ubs-translations.org/ or http://www.wycliffe.org/ instead of sending it to some false prosperity preacher thinking that it will result in some blessing or some favor from God. Thank you, and may God bless and be with you.

  12. SIMPLY SAVED!!!!! said

    Have you all went crazy. Don’t you understand that Jesus is the WAY THE TRUTH AND THE LIFE!!!! Stop gossiping and pray. Instead of worrying about everyone else be about your FATHER’s work.

  13. SIMPLY SAVED!!!!!: “Stop gossiping and pray.” First of all, like most of the rest you are a false accuser. It is only gossiping if A) it isn’t true and B) it is done in the wrong spirit. Everything that I say is true to the best of my knowledge, and it is done to help people stop following after false preachers and doctrines rather than out of a hatred or jealousy of or fascination with the false preacher. Why are you opposing works of righteousness and defending what you know to be evil? Are you in fact saved as you claim? No saved person would ever defend light in favor of darkness. Worrying about everyone else IS the Father’s work. It is called A BURDEN FOR THE LOST. It is called A DESIRE NOT TO HAVE WOLVES DECEIVE AND SCATTER THE SHEEP. It is called BEING YOUR BROTHER’S KEEPER. If you don’t do those things, then you do not love your neighbor, which means you do not love God. If it were someone following Islam or witchcraft, you would tell them that their beliefs are false and will take them to the lake of fire, right? So why is anyone practicing false Christianity any different, huh?

  14. Jennifer said

    I love this site. You have said everything that I have had playing over and over in my head like a taperecorder. I want so badly for the truth to be known. When the world turned from God – at least we had the church. And now these super popular megapreachers have turned so far from a Christlike life or a Biblical perspective – and it makes me hold my daughter tighter and pray. The darkness in American Christianity is overwhelming.

    I worked for a large Christian network at one time and have worked personally with Juanita Bynum and Paula White and I can tell you personally – if the Spirit of God lives in them, He was silenced long ago. They are difficult, demanding divas who huff and puff and preach nonsense. They are surrounded by these teams of sycophants that tell them they are wonderful, who cower in fear of offending them, and who make sure that at all times they are comfortable and untouched by reality.

    I am a Believer – and I have more respect for Angelina Jolie than these people. At least she will look in the face of poverty and do something about it. All of the money these people raise for “missions” just pay for airtime in poverty stricken countries. Not a cent goes to feed, clothe, heal, translate Bibles. It is all a scam. It truly is. Get a job at a Christian network – see the truth.

    Judgment is going to be difficult – and we as Believers have a responsibility to cry out against this – to show an unbelieving world that this has NOTHING TO DO WITH CHRIST. He is not a part of this nonsense.

    Keep telling the truth. Keep fighting the “pray for them and don’t judge” people. They are wrong. Jesus threw tables and called people vipers. We are to do the same. These people – both of them – are vipers.

  15. Steve Munsey and Morris Cerullo. A Spiritually Deadly Combination!

    So I turned on my TV back on 9/3/2007, to one of the supposedly “Christian” TV networks, the Lack of Divine Inspiration Network. And who did I see on my screen, but none other than Steve Munsey and Morris Cerullo together. On the program …

  16. Esther said

    Seriously, I think we shouldnt be judging others. We are just as human as they. what is the guaratee that you wouldnt do the same things if you were to be found in her shoes? have mercy dear, God had mercy on us too. its such mercy that helps us forgive men and brethren.remember that your lil’ sin that easily beset is as bad as her heresies. she is your sister.

  17. Esther: Suppose you were to cross my path as I were stealing something, lying, or looking lustfully at some woman (or man). Would you tell me the error of my ways? Would you tell any children that were about that were witnessing my behavior and being influenced by it, obviously impressed, envying, and desiring to emulate it, that what I am doing is a sin against God and that they should turn aside from it? Or would you refrain and be silent because doing so is “judging” me? If you would stand silent in the face of my sin and my causing others to sin, how can you say that you love me? How can you say that you love those that I am misleading? How can you say that you love GOD? Simple, you cannot. There is no way that you can love God and not oppose sin, especially in the church. And that is what it comes down to.

  18. Danita said

    I still can’t get over the fact that T.D. Jakes and Paula White were both interviewed on the “Oprah Winfrey Show” and they NEVER told the millions of people watching that JESUS IS THE ONLY WAY TO SALVATION! What was holding their tongues? Their appearances on the program was worthless without saying this.

  19. Danita: Do not forget, Oprah Winfrey, despite being heavily into the false religion of New Age, is a professed Christian too; a member of the same Trinity Church of Christ in Chicago that Barack Obama attends.

  20. SG said

    It is amazing to me that the advocates of the “do not judge” doctrine are so unknowing of the scriptural responsibility to judge. It seems some don’t believe that as Christians we are ever allowed to judge anyone at anytime. I personally believe that we can follow the commandment to LOVE and accept the responsibility to judge in a righteous way. (It is very possible for us to walk and chew gum at the same time.)Here is my main problem with the “do not judge” theory. Okay, I’m going to make this as simple as I can for those who are confused about this. If you receive a summons in the mail to appear at your local court house to serve on a jury, (are we good so far?) as a Christian are you going to stand before a court official and say, “I’m sorry your honor, my bible tells me I am not allowed to judge so I can not perform my civic duty to this court.” What do you think will happen? I’ll tell you. Your butt is going to spend the night in jail on contempt of court charges if you don’t obey the instructions of the JUDGE (who happens to be a human and maybe even a Christian.) I’m sorry if I seem like I’m losing my patience with the level of immaturity amoungst grown Christian people. I’m going to continue with one more practical example to bring my point home. (continued on next comment)

  21. SG said

    Okay, ready? In regards to judging Christian leadership who we find to be involved in gross ministerial misconduct. As sheep, what do we do?

    I have raised two sons in the fear and admonition of the Lord all their lives. The only real way I can teach them is to be an example of what I expect from them. My youngest son is 20 and is in the Sheriff’s Academy learning the civil codes of our local government. Soon he will be on patrol keeping our streets safe and arresting those who commit crime. Okay, say one day I just decide to wake up one morning and start dealing crack cocaine out of my lovely little kitchen. My son comes to the house and catches me selling dope to the high schools who park in front of my house everyday. Remember now, he is a cop. He knows right from wrong and has a working knowledge of the law and the word of God. I’ve told him all his life that if he obeys his mother and his father he will have long life and good success. But now I’ve placed him in an awkward position. I’ve broken the law and he has the responsibility as a cop to arrest me on the spot. Do I get to throw the “obey your mother” card at him and expect him to cover up my crime? Say it wasn’t a crime, but that he caught me having an affair against his father. Can I demand because he is the son and I am the mother for him to not come against me? No, I could not do either of those things in either of those instances. It is ridiculous for me to even put my son in that kind of peril. Just because I decided to forsake that which I know is right, I can not expect him to turn a blind eye and abuse my relationship with my son. Children of God, you can’t keep quiet any longer. Yes, pray, but do what you have to to preserve the family of God. You know the word and you judge by the word. The word gives us the wisdom to understand exactly what the will of the Lord is. Sometimes love is doing what is best for the people we love even though what is best for them might mean doing whatever it takes to bring them back to the truth. This may require correction, stepping down, and a long period of ongoing discripleship under qualified leadership. It is called justice and God is a just God. Okay class, you’re dismissed. :-)

  22. Hello Everyone:
    I have been following many of your comments and I must say to the learned, and those who are wise, that the apostate brothers and sisters are the least in the kingdom, and you who are wise should go before them and offer the water of life and the true manna which comes from the word of G_d. If you feel that you are correct, (which you are to some degree) then your mission in life is clear to these, and this is your calling. Will you go? For many of them started out hearing the word of G_d, and at some point went astray…so will you be the one to leave the 99 to go after the one? The word of G_d is as sharp as a double edged sword so that it cuts both ways. So if all are willing to speak out against apostacy and corruption in the body of believers, then you must be ready to follow Yeshua where he is leading you. It means that you leave the apostate teaching of the church which mixes love of G_d with the love of the bull god (Baal and Molach). Those who are Old Testament history buffs should know full well that bull worship is unexceptable. If this is so, what are all of you doing in the economic system that we have today? Have you all left everything to follow Yeshua? Do you work a job? Do you make money? If you do, then you are just as apostate as the preachers you speak against. Are you unimpeachable? Look at the stock market. Are you aware that it is the bull god? That it has the feet of a bear? Are you aware of these things? Or don’t you believe it? Understand this, you will either believe all that Yeshua has said, and follow him, or you are all liars. If you work, as Peter attempted to do three times, and in the process denied Yeshua, you are not following him. Is this a judgement? Or can you judge for yourselves where your help comes from? Do not think that you are any better then the jews in the times of the kings of Israel or Judah! For they worshipped baal and molach and other detestable idols, and gave thanks at the same time to the L_rd of Hosts! That my brothers and sisters is blasphamy. Look at the system that we call so great, and blessed. Is it really? If you are a part of that system, then you too worship baal and molach. Preachers who tell others to go out and work and then bring in a defiled tithe. Telling them to invest in the “economy” and the stock market. All these things are the sin of Solomon and Ephraim. They are a trap. Solomon, the wisest king, bowed down at the end of his life to the baals, molach, and other detestable idols, and did evil in the eyes of G_d. The kingdom was ripped from his hand and divided into two. The wages at the end of his life where six hundred and sixty six! Check your bibles. If you are truly wise, you will not except the wages of Solomon. Yeshua did not use corporate sponsership or partnerships to feed the multitudes. He did not need the endorsements of State of Rome or the State of Herod. He used the meal of a child to feed the multitudes. You can not feed the poor with corporate help. The church contains lost sheep, who will bring go looking for them? Torah loving Jews are the lost sheep, who will go looking for them? Ishmael, the least of Yeshua’s brothers, who will give them food? Water? Who will go to dress them in righteousness? Who will visit them in prison? I tell you the truth, that just as the scriptures say of Abraham from G_d, “I will bless those who bless you and curse those who curse you” so the same goes for the seed of Ishmael. So goes the same for those grafted in as adopted children, and so goes the same for those who are called by his Holy Name. Be careful how you speak against Ishmael, for he is the rock that men will stumble over. Remember that when he was rejected by his father Abraham and sent out into the desert to die, that an angel came and told Hagar that he too would be a great nation? This is Isaac’s big brother. Ishmael was the first to draw water from the rock! It will be Ishmael’s seed that will shine forth in righteousness when Yeshua reveals himself to them. And it is Isaac’s big brother that will in fact fight for Israel against those who say they are Jew’s yet are not. Do not be so quick to believe that Islam is the enemy. Instead, if you believe that Islam is the enemy, give them food and water. Let the righteousness of G_d show forth in this generation. All must evaluate your lives and rid yourselves prejudices and hatred and idolatry. Yeshua is knocking at the door, will you open the door to him?

  23. SG said

    All I can say to that speech is “WOW.” Jesus Christ is Lord of all. I’ll even use the “O.” He is more than a prophet, more than a man, He is GOD!! He died and rose again, no other so called prophet of g_d can make that claim. Jesus’ blood completely blots out our sin and allows us communion with the Father. Jesus’ is God and no other g_ds will I put before Him. And I will “occupy” or “work” until He returns for His bride, the Church. “Where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.”

  24. Be careful not to confuse the liberty at work in political spheres and the liberty we have in Yeshua, which makes us free of all political, all religious and all contrived humanistic wisdom. The liberty that we have in G_d the Father through Yeshua his son, is that we no longer have to occupy, as the pagans do, but through liberty that Yeshua provides by faith, we can live a life far greater than the one that we see and experience today in this life.
    It is not against the law to not work a job, and it is certainly not against the law to do the will of G_d. We are not called to be invaders, but children of the most high G_d. As children we do not need to occupy, but we do need to abide. He has called us to abide in him, not occupy in him. I hope that all will see the beauty of entering into Yeshua’s rest.

  25. SG said

    Confused, whose confused? I can manage to be a Christian, in every aspect, and function as Christ would have me too in any arena. I am not swayed by every wind of doctrine. I know the Word and that is where the source of my rest comes from, not in hiding away in some cave fearful of what this big bad old world can do to me. Christ is the Head of the Church and from that influence the Church is able to prevail in the midst of any cultural influences against scripture. This is why the Church will prevail in the end. I’ve read the end of the Book. NT scripture is clear what our position is. The world now is only preparing us for an eternal reign of God’s Kingdom. Where we are weak, He is strong. Where we are poor, He is rich. I don’t need to be lulled into a false sense of peace or rest. I know who I am in Christ and because of that understanding I can approach life with a victorious mindset. In Him the Church will not fail. Again, “Where the Spirit of the Lord is, there IS liberty.” I take that liberty and remain free from the bondage of sin and death. I will not be bewitched or beguiled back into the bondage of the law. Whom the Son of God sets free is free indeed. He that begun this good work is able to complete it in me. He is faithful. We denounce sin and He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If my eternity was based upon my own will power alone, I guess I would stay home and hide from reality. Thank God I can choose life over death, obedience over disobedience. I do so because I love God not because I am such a holy wonderfully perfect person. I am a Christian forgiven by the grace of God and empowered to never return to the bondage of sin. Freedom came to me as a result of His blood. From the top of my head to the souls of my feet, I am covered with it. Praise Him!! All glory and honor and dominion are His forever and ever.

  26. SG said

    We as Christians should endeavor to reconcile anyone who has gone astray. For those who once knew the word and then made the choice to denounce the teaching of the gospel of Jesus Christ the Messiah, we follow the command of scripture to bring correction with the motive of restoration. This should be the way in which we approach leaders who are ensued in various forms of ministerial misconduct. If the leader refuses to observe sound biblical correction then they no longer can serve as an overseer. We pray for restoration. Restoration begins through repentance. If sin remains hidden, then restoration continues for the whole body through some restructuring of the leadership. This does not mean we have forsaken the one unrepentant, it means we give them time for God’s sovereign correction looking daily down the road for the prodical son to return. This is love and judgement working simultaneously to carry out the will of God. Correction does not mean rejection. Judgement does not mean condemnation. There is a penalty for sin and there is a reward for receiving grace. God is the ultimate judge. We as Christians do our best to adMinister the Word. If in the end, our motive is restoration, our chances of success is increased.

  27. Yes, yet you do not obey and your words testify against you. Do you believe that you should live in a cave apart from this life? Our lives do not consist in “hiding away” but in shining out in the power that only Yeshua provides. There is no power in the world, or what it has to provide, so where is your faith? What have we to do with the world and all it’s trappings? Being ensnared and so entangled in self-deception concerning money? Did you really believe that the talents in the New Testament was about money or even worldly wealth? The parable of the talents and the shrewd manager were about worldly wisdom and G_dly faith, as G_d apportions. God always uses the foolish things of this world to shame the wise. Money is foolishness above all else, and those who put their faith in it will get their just reward. Yeshua was not talking about money, but about true riches which come down from heaven, perfect in every way. That is the Holy Spirit, wisdom, knowledge, discernment, and communion with him, the word of G_d. These are the treasures. You can not serve G_d and money, nor can it be justified by grace, for grace shall never be used as a license for immorality. We all do reap what we sow, and we all scatter and gather. But what is the harvest? I would rather know that Yeshua is amazingly faithful and that he always provides a way to glorify him with out selling him out and betraying him. It takes faith to believe that he can make a way in this world that would glorify him, and to show an even greater world than that of the current age. How many would follow? Many will turn back in sorrow, because they would not sell all they had and gave it to the poor. Many will turn back in sorrow when Yeshua comes like a thief, and all the possessions are gone, when two are in the field and one leaves to follow him. When two are in the bed, and one gets up to leave and follow him. Did you really believe that the scripture was about the rapture? When he his calling the sheep hear his voice and follow, and I tell you he is not saying follow him into corporate life, into the bank, into politics, because then he would just be tempting us to prostitute ourselves.
    This current system is operated by the ten lost tribes, and by their fruits you will know them. They are as we are the ten virgins, the ten talents, the ten horns. Do you believe that the beast that comes from the earth is the anti-christ? Well look around you, it is everywhere. There are ten major stock exchanges that rule over the seven continents, and that lamb that speaks like a dragon is so-called democracy. It promises much peace and looks so gentle, but if you do not obey it’s demands it speaks like a dragon. Look around you. What do you see? Do you believe that you will defeat the beast? If not, I guess it is just better to join it, right? To obey? To believe in the system that has caused more blood shed and destruction for “our way of life?” Is that what we call justice by G_ds standards? Is this the way of truth? Do you even know who owns the federal reserve? Do you know where he lives? Do you know that the state of Israel was stolen? It was stolen by the bankers. Follow the blood line and you will see. It was only possible for this to happen because we “believe” that “god” has blessed us. This is all smoke in his nostrils. Follow the trail while you can, and see who and what is in control. Ultimately G_d is in control and has allowed all this to take place, but it is a test. Will we pass? Or will we bare false witness against other nations with out knowing the true story? Will we really destroy Iran? Would you? Would you vote to go to war? Did you vote for war lord Bush? Do you know that the last of my brothers and sisters of the line of Benjamin and Judah dwell in safety in Iran? These are two precious tribes, and they refused the trap that Zionist have set for them. Benjamin is the tribe I am from, and Benjamin has a unique attribute, they are joined genetically to Gad and Shelah(Shiloh)of Judah and also there is the tribe of Judah through Shelah (Selah). It would be beyond appauling for anyone to proclaim war against Iran, but none the less, those here in America think you have power in the vote, yet all the power is in your pocket. Your taxes pay for wars, false testimony, injustice in the courts, corrupt government. Yet you believe that you are taking the kingdom for G_d? Everyone blames another government for war or death, but it is the bankers who give the loans! Will we actually blame Hitler for the Holocost? Dig a little deeper, because it was his family that owned the banks that paid for the Holocost. It was the taxes, it was those who owned and still own the banks. They are only a few families, yet own all the money. Do the research and you will find that those who financed the war against the Jews were Jewish themselves.
    How long will you believe propaganda and deny the truth? You can worship baal and molach, but those who stole Israel, and set up their Satanic Temple (Scottish Rite Freemasonry) in Tel Aviv, Israel, are on a collision coarse with G_d, and all who are a part of the system that made them as powerful as they are today will have to give an account.

  28. SG said

    You are right. My words do testify against me. Against my own righteousness. Yet my words testify to the glory and honor of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. Obviously, you did not read my narrative because I clearly pointed out that we do not live in a cave. You are filled with anger, violence, and a murderous spirit against the people of God. Jews, Christians, whoever does not call upon the name of allah. You are not fooling anyone with your eloquence of speech. God is not against the prosperity of our nation. He gave it to us for the advancement of His Kingdom. This is why those lunatics destroyed our twin towers. They think if they can shame us into being broke, they can shame us from the call of God and the commission of Jesus Christ the Son of the Most High. This gospel shall be preached to Judea, Samaria and the uttermost parts of the earth. Every knee shall bow and every tongue shall confess that Jesus Christ is Lord of all. I invite you to turn away from the path of self righteousness and come fully to the knowledge that God the Father sent His Son Jesus Christ to die on the cross for your sins. He loves you and welcomes you into His eternal grace. If you confess with your heart that Jesus Christ died and was raised again and believe only in His atonement, you shall be saved. Pray and ask Him to come into your heart and fill you with His Spirit. Old things will pass away and all things shall become new. You will be a new creation in Christ and the eyes of your understanding will be opened to the greatest Love on earth. Nothing will ever seperate you from Him. Only believe that His mercy that endures forever and is new every morning will part every iniquity and cause the enemy of your soul to be banished forever. We do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities and powers of darkness. Fight the hardness of your heart and allow the Father to create in you a new heart after His own. Jesus Loves You!!

  29. SG said

    I’m going to prepare some spaghetti and meatballs for my husband and son. I’ll be leaving this discussion now. The gospel was preached and Jesus is glorified, so farewell friends. Success to the Kingdom, Success to you.

  30. benevolence said

    i cannot believe this, i am very upset dissapointed and outraged. the coming of jesus is near and many things like this will occur, all we hav to do is to keep our guards down and be sober, otherwise we will fall into the trap. however, whether u disagree with the leader or not, we still hav to pry for them

  31. I am not a muslim, but thank you for identifying me with them (truly). I am a messianic Jewish believer. I have been a believer for twenty years now. There is no hardness of heart for me, just hardness of words which our L_rd Yeshua (Jesus)gave to his disciples. If I were a muslim, I would not believe in Yeshua as G_d, who came of the virgin Mary (Miriam), lived a sinless life, suffered and died on a cross, and was raised to life by the power of the Holy Spirit (Ruach HaKodesh)three days later, and ascended into heaven and is now and forever more seated at the right hand of G_d the Father. Muslims do not believe this. I do. But none the less, they are my brothers and sisters, as they are your brothers and sisters, if you have been grafted into the seed of Abraham. This war right now is not about religion, but troublemakers have made it about religion to justify fighting against them. Lumping me with muslim terrorists would be like me lumping you with the pope during the inquision, or anti-abortionist who blow up clinics. The sayings of Yeshua are hard sayings. I did not make them up, and he told us the end from the beginning. My love is for the sheep that are marked for slaughter. It is my heart cry. I am not the great Shepard, but I would concider myself one of his sheep dogs. It was no accident that right before the great depression, there was so much talk about the rapture. It was spoken of, taught by the leaders, and many followed believing the end was upon them. They sold their belongings and went up on a hill to wait for the coming of the L_rd. But it did not come for them and it was called the Great Disappointment. Not long after that came the Great Depression. They go together. The central banks create great amounts of debt, housing markets take a dive, the banks create more money to flood the system, which in turn lowers the value of the dollar creating inflation, and they collapse the system. They take businesses, property, and the dignity of people. Only the very rich one percent survive unharmed. When this happens again, and it is going to happen, it will not be because of extremists who hate our way of life. It will be because the banking system only cares for aquiring wealth and does not care who gets hurt in the process. We should be teaching one another how to care for the land that G_d has given us, so that in those times of lack, we will be able to provide food, clothing and shelter. It will be terrible in those days for those who have relied on the system for food, yet do not know how to grow it themselves. Who do not know how to do anything but work for money. It is time for the children of G_d to take the skills that they have, and come together and learn how to not only sow the word of G_d, but also to sow the seeds that produce abundant food, and to give it at the appropriate time. That we can do this, and with compassion and love, reach out to those who in times of collapse have no recourse. I believe that G_d has put that vision into many people’s hearts…to go and prepare a place. The amount of abundance that comes from the earth can feed and clothe many, and it will help to increase the faith of those left devestated by a system that does not care for their well being. To work the earth, and produce food, clothing, shelter, fellowship, is a labor of love. It demands no wages, but can produce a harvest of righteousness. Everyone in the body of Christ has a job to do, but today, it seems everyone is doing the same job. We all have value and are precious in his sight, and my love for the body of believers is deep, because the body of Christ carries within them, his Holy Spirit. I want to be a reflection of Yeshua, not a mirror image of the church. We will all be tempted as Yeshua was tempted by Satan. We will be tempted to turn stones into bread (turning the church into spiritual food) which leads to the second temptation, to take a “leap” of faith into something that has been twisted in the word of G_d, and finally to bow down to Satan, so that all the world would be ours. They are Yeshua’s temptations still, because if he dwells within our hearts, this is how we will be tempted. Many of the churches have already completed all three temptations. The Beatitudes is a key to how we should live. Look at all that Yeshua said, and who would be blessed. I want to be rich towards G_d.
    As far as the twin towers and many reports that you and I have been given, there is still another story. The twin towers was destroyed and they killed over 3,000 people, but what is being put in its place? The freedom tower. Ah, look at the financing and who is building it, and you will have an idea as to who really tore it down. The building is going to be 1776 feet tall and has other very interesting attributes. Why is this number important? Well, it was the year of our independance right? Well it was also the year the Illuminati formed as a structured organization. Who do you think is funding all of this? Who do you think really funded the attack on the trade towers? You will find that it is the same ones that funded all the wars. It gave a reason to go to war. To sacrifice lives, innocent lives. I told you they do not care for anyone. Is there any end in sight? Is it radical muslim terrorists or is it the mossad? These are questions that no one is willing to explore. They just believe what they are told. Do a little research on the internet while you can, and see for yourself. You will find many conspiracies out there, but that is to create confusion. We can look to G_d’s word to see everything. Read Nahum, and ask yourself, who are the Ninivites? Is it modern Iran? Look at the fruit of the Egyptians, Assyerians, Greeks, Romans, and Babylonians. The L_rd said “By their fruit you will know them.” Read the prophets, and you will be able to see who is who in the world today. All media is owned and controlled by a few families, and they are also the one’s who own the banks. They control what information you get. But, right now, while we can, the internet is a tool to get the information that is not told to us.
    Did you know that Sun Yung Moon was coranated by our members of Congress to be the messiah Jesus? Did you know that Moon owns a very prominate news paper in NY? How about that he dug Jerry Falwell out of debt? Did you know that the current king of Spain has a pedigree that has him entitled as not only the king of Spain but also king of Jerusalem? Look up Reverand Sun Yung Moon and who he is connected to in our great government, and look up King Juan Carlos of Spain. There is so much going on in the world, and my love runs deep for those who are G_d’s, and for those who are lost. The only debt that is to be remaining is our love for one another.
    We must sharpen one another as iron sharpens iron. I take no offense to what you have said to me, and know that we are here to support and to build each other up in our most Holy faith. May you help to increase my faith, and may I help to increase yours. This is the “interest” that is gained by investing our talents.

  32. http://www.jewwatch.com/jew-leaders-rothschild-timeline.html

    I will send more links if you are interested. This one is quite long, but incredibly informative. These things are historically documented, and lead up to our present situation. It will take a while to read it, but it is worth it. The prophet Hosea says “My people die because of a lack of knowledge.”
    I will put up a few other links for all to read as well.
    May the L_rd bless you.

  33. Eden Hadassah: God bless you sister in Christ. I will investigate your link.

  34. Fran said

    Eden

    I’ve read your comments. I was taught that Jewish believers were not permitted to speak the word God, out of true reverence for God. Also, when we speak God, would it have any relationship to the word elowahh in our understanding? If not, please explain. One more thing in Mattityahu 1:20 is this scripture speaking of G_d when itspeaks of the angle of ADONAI? As you know, I can”t get my keyboard to capitalize the a above the other capitalizations .

  35. We all have many freedom’s (liberties) in Yeshua. My leaving the letter out of the word God does not have to do with regulation, but rather the respect that I have for practicing Torah Jew’s. I do not want to lead them to stumble. Saying the name of G_d is used in reverence, and not to be taken in vain. What I say often time’s is offensive as it is, and I get a lot of back lash from it, but do not want my Jewish brothers and sisters to stumble over this matter. It is the only reason I choose to word the name of God as G_d and Lord as L_rd.
    My desire is that I do not cause any to stumble in my freedom, but as it is, the rabbinic tradition (man’s tradition) is to take certain letters out of the name of G_d. This is not written in the Torah nor is it written anywhere in the scriptures of old or new testament. This is tradition, which Yeshua came to break, because it is man’s law, not G_d’s law. It can be a stumbling block to them, and I would rather not squabble over how to spell it, and out of respect for them and love for the L_rd, speak in a way that they may be able to recognize. Thats all. It has no power, as other tradition’s of man have no power, but I again, choose to not use my freedom to cause someone else to stumble, or be turned away in bitterness.

  36. http://www.greatdreams.com/revelation/another_anti_christ.htm

    Another interesting read. I recommend reading this,but I have not done the research to verify it’s truthfulness, so I caution all to search for the facts to back up the claims. Let me know what you find out.

  37. Eden Hadassah: I demand that you start your own weblog immediately. http://wordpress.com/signup

  38. Fran said

    Eden,

    Thank you for your reply. I asked for reasons of being able to understand and not to be offensive. I’ve always beleived that it was out of reverence for God that the Torah Jews practice. Just wanted to be sure that I knew why (mans’ tradition). Mans’ traditions seperate and divide. Yes, I thank God for my liberties that I have in Christ Jesus.

  39. I do have just one more link, and this one is also long. I am sure that it will keep everyone on the edge of their seats. Again, I can not stress the importance of backing up the information recieved with facts, for our benefit of having correct information. I feel it is so important to be able to step back from the world we have been fed and look at a bigger picture that has been emerging.
    This link is about mind control and Billy Graham. It also has many other links on the site that you can explore.

    http://educate-yourself.org/mc/illumformula5Bchap.shtml

    Healtheland, I am not sure how to take your demand…
    If you are telling me that I should start my own blog about all this, and I separate myself from all of you…or…
    Is your desire for me to not come back to your site? If you wish me to not make any further comments, I understand, and I will leave no further comments on your site.

  40. Fran said

    Eden,

    I forgot to mention, I thank God for sending you to this site.

  41. Eden Hadassah: Oh no, I am terribly sorry that I communicated so ineffectively! Please, come and participate as much as possible! I was merely stating that with the theological views and information that you have, you would make for a great Messianic Jewish blogger, and thereby share your knowledge with a lot of people that can use it.

  42. SG said

    Many of the things you mention are found in scripture mostly to confirm the fact that Jesus is coming soon. The world can rip itself to pieces with it’s greed, perversions, and corrupt systems. It is all part of the biblical story. Your news is not news. However, the Church, which is the Body of Christ…His Bride, should invest Her resources into Laboring for the lost instead of bickering about what the Bible has already told us will happen. The practical application of scripture is more valuable in our daily walk than a bunch of clouds of propaganda that promise rain but do not deliver. Simply put, we should watch and pray and go. If your motive is not about winning the lost to Jesus Christ through scriptural conversion than what is it? Remember that a whole lot of things are going to take place worse than all the things you’ve mentioned combined, but the Church will not be around to witness it. This is promised in scripture. This is why I can use the liberty that I have in Christ to focus my attention on preaching the Gospel vs preaching and giving glory to the nature of a fallen society.

    You’ve also made many allegations about me that you are one hundred percent wrong about from the very beginning. But I forgive you and will continue preaching the Good News of the Gospel of Jesus Christ to a dying world.

    Shalom.

  43. Thats a relief! I think though that the blog sites that I leave comments on are great for talking with others. My father and I didn’t see eye to eye for many years on the subject of the money system, even though my family has done a great deal of research on the subject of “Jews who are not Jews”, and I didn’t press the matter with him, until, in the last year, he began to see for himself what was going on, connecting all the “dots”,and now he wants me to write about it also. I prefer to be engaged with others, and to enjoy fellowship, even if it is via the internet. I can not write and publish a book about all this, (thats a trap). Everything should be free for all to read, and I will not allow those who own publishing companies to make money off this subject. So if you don’t mind, I would love to keep in contact with all of you.
    There is much prayer and intercession that is to be done on our parts. We have been shown these things so that we might know how to pray, and so that we know which “strong man” needs to be bound. All the preachers and prophets that stand for Zionist Israel, seed faith ministries, and other things non-scriptural, need prayer for the strong holds that have taken them captive. When we come together to pray, we aren’t praying against our brothers and sisters, but against the principalities, against powers in unseen places. Yeshua said that every thing that has been hidden shall be made known, and right now it is being made known. So we intercede for those who are led astray, and with great compassion rebuke, correct and encourage them. I have opened up dialogue with Mr. Hagee, and I will be doing the same with Rod Parsley, who heretically calls our L_rd Yeshua the “Canaan King”. Yuck. My L_rd was not a Canaan king! To say so is to say that he was the king of the liniage of Ham, son of Noah! To do so means that he says that my King was the king of the Philistines! Our King is the King of Kings and the L_rd of L_rds! From the line of Judah through the seed of Shem and Abraham. It is comments like his that throw out truth and replace it with error. It sounds so close to the truth, but remember that Noah told Ham “Cursed be Canaan…Canaan shall be the slave of Shem.” So should Mr. Parsley say that Yeshua was a Canaan king? Or King of Israel, son of David? What happens when this becomes a doctrine, and other believers start quoting him? It is heretical, at best. And it is a suspicious statement.
    I left for Mr. Hagee a riddle in my letter to him…
    “Ham when up to Japheth’s house…breaking in, he stole Japheths clothes and headed out for the land of Canaan. Upon entering the land of Canaan, he started acting and speaking like Shem, putting Shem into slavery. What shall be his outcome? Shall Ham take the things devoted to G_d?
    This riddle has to do with the seed of Ham,(the Babylonians, the Assyerians, the Egyptians, the Philistines) dressing up in the disguise of Europeans, then starting to act like Jews (Shem), and then once coming into the land of Canaan (Palestine/Israel), putting the real decendance of Shem into slavery. This has been done, and it is sanctioned by our government, while they suffer. Along with them suffer the muslims and christians. It is what Revelations warns us about “the Jews that are not Jews but of the synagogue of Satan.”
    The reason I started talking about these leaders, is that I do not merely talk about them, but also pray for them and I have tried to open dialogue with them. That is all we can do.
    So we all have a job cut out for us! Let us do it faithfully with all the strength that Yeshua provides.
    Thank you for allowing me to visit and talk with all of you here.
    May you all be blessed.
    Love Eden

  44. SG,
    I don’t know what you are talking about.?
    I do, however, accept your forgiveness when ever you would like to give it.
    Thank you.

  45. johnkaniecki said

    A thought has occurred to me when reading these interesting comments and others on this site. We must remember that there is milk and that there is meat. A lot of things are hard for people to understand, especially if they don’t have a good understanding of the Word of God. We must be patient and loving towards those who need the milk.

    Reading Eden Hadassah’s comments and others I must say that I am very glad that he is speaking these truths. I understand that a lot of sites that speak about these things dissapear from the internet. Though I agree with what he says (most of it at least as I haven’t look at every single detail) we must also realize these lessons to are difficult. Where as with the Bible issues we can point to scripture, here the waters get murky. Also there are a great many lies out there and it is difficult to emancipate one from them. I myself made seven trips to psychiatric hospitals from reprucussions of the brainwashing. But praise God the truth has set me free. I think we all know things about these subjects. Perhaps some that the others don’t know.

    The key to the timing of wordl events is China. (I know God controls all things.) I will elaborate my thoughts on that one later when I have time. Thanks for sharpening my sword.

    Love,

    John

  46. johnkaniecki said

    Healtheland,

    I must compliment you for an excellent answer in number twelve.

    Before I came to the Lord I abused alcohol and drugs. It took me about two years to find out that it was a dead end. Unfortunately some people never find out and the drugs and alchohol destroy them. These false preachers are like that. It is obvious to some that they are all about money. Even my friends who know practically nothing about the Bible see that these people are just out for money. As a Christian familiar with the Word of God I see the abuse plainly. (The little I have seen. No tv remember.)

    Stephen I hope you are still with this blog and reading on. Do you realize Jesus Christ was born in a manger. That during his ministry he was homeless and that he often slept in the garden. That the only possession he had of worth at that time was one good garment. This is the garment that the Romans soldiers cast lots for. Do you know that Paul worked with his own hands to provide for himself and that he was often in hunger.

    Now contrast this to these people on tv. Just concentrate on this issue alone. Did you know this woman has a three million dollar mansion. (Look at the http://www.independentconservative.com for details.) Now use the brain that God gave you. (I am not being sarcastic at all.) Is it right for a preacher of the gospel to own such a house? You can buy a nice house for far far less. Wouldn’t that money had been better spent on many other things? Like feeding the poor, buying Bibles, sending the troops care packages, supporting missionaries, providing scholarships for students in need, support rehabilitation houses for drug addcits. Why the list goes on and on.

    So Stephen if you are still with could you please answer me with a simple yes or no. Do you think it is right for a preacher of the gospel to spend over three million dollars on a home? Of course you can add as much comments as you like. How this relates to the discussion at hand I will try to explain later.

    Love,

    John

  47. SG said

    The gospel of Jesus Christ is not only the meat of the Word, it is the bone, the marrow, the fat, the muscle, the tendions, the whole Lamb. There is no greater revelation. There is no greater truth. It is the only way to the Father. It is the only biblical acceptable means of atonement, redemption, sanctification, justification, ect. In the end, the entire book points to the truth of the Gospel of Jesus Christ. His death, His burial, His resurrection and His soon coming return. He is not milk, He is Water that gives everlasting life, that quenches the thirst of all of His creation. The only brain washing that occurs here is the Washing of the water by the Word that causes us to become a new creation in Christ Jesus. All are welcome and none are ever turned away.

  48. john kaniecki : Mine was good but yours was better!

  49. SG said

    #47, The answer is no.

  50. The milk and the meat…
    I love how Paul in one breath says that we should not be preaching cerimonial foods which are of no value, and then refer to the word of G_d in the same vein using food.
    I have raised four children and I have one grandchild. I nursed all four of my children, and I bottle feed my grand-daughter. Paul did not have the luxury of bearing children, so his teaching on milk and meat to me seems a little impatient. Nursing my children brought me great satisfaction, knowing that I was helping to sustain and nurture my little ones. As they grew, they still did not eat meat, because they were still not ready to digest it. Yet I gave them what was necessary in the in-between time. After they had teeth, I gave them some meat, but cut it up into little peices so that they wouldn’t choke on it. When I saw that they could handle bigger peices, I watched them eat, and made sure they were not taking peices that were too big for them to swallow.
    I always watched over their eating so they would not choke on the food that I gave them.
    As a mother, I never while nursing my children, rushed them to the next thing, but instead allowed them the warmth and comfort of the closeness that I provided. But as they got older, I needed to begin to wean them, and this is done with patience and love.
    I believe that where Paul was talking about milk and meat, he was being a little impatient, showing his human-ness. When we read the scriptures, the L_rd always uses imperfect people to show a greater truth, and at the same time he is able to keep his word pure. If we follow Paul’s attitude, we may end up weaning those who need milk, and give them food that they are not equipt to chew on. Milk is a beautiful thing. It says in essence that those who drink only milk are delicate, soft, innocent, helpless and need tending to all the time. We must be patient with others, whether we are milk drinkers or meat eaters. My grand-daughter is only four months old, and when she sits at the table with me, and she watches me eat, she doesn’t even understand what I am doing. But it fasinates her! I wouldn’t dare give her even a taste of my food, because she is not ready for it…but she watches. I have cherished every phase of my children and my grand child’s life, and I know that G_d does the same with us. He gives us his pure word, and nurishes us. He watches over us with loving kindness and with tenderness and compassion, and tends to our every need. As we grow in him, and we are ready for something more, he provides it to us, all the time knowing what phase of development we are in. When weaning comes, sometimes it is hard, there is much tears and sometimes distress, but as we come to enjoy the fruits, (which are often given while a child is being weaned) we see before us something that is different, yet just as good. As we enjoy the fruit, he adds more to our diet, and again, we look in amazement at all that is available to us. Finally, as he introduces the meat, it seems fragmented…little peices. As we grow, the peices become bigger, and we can identify what the meat is, the texture, the smell and the taste. And although some may know this full experience, we should be patient with those who are still on the milk, because they are watching. Having this understanding makes it possible for us to be tender hearted, because we too at one point drank only milk.

  51. Here is a link to show how “Israel” has celebrated the 70th anniversary of the Tel Aviv stock exchange.
    Mind you, that when the Kingdom of Solomon was split into two, because Solomon worshipped idols at the end of his life, the kingdom of Israel was led by King Jeraboam who after he was made king, created baals (bull gods) in Bethel and in Dan (modern day Tel Aviv) and said to the ten tribes which were given to him, “Here are your gods that brought you up out of the land of Egypt.”
    It seems that Dan has held fast to the traditions of Ephraim. (King Jeroboam was from the line of Ephraim).

    http://outdoors.webshots.com/album/515967443zKHiqu

  52. SG said

    You are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus, for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. There is neither Jew, nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female for you are all one in Christ Jesus. IF you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed and heirs according to the promise. What I am saying is that as long as the slave, although he owns the whole estate, he is subject to guardians and trustees until the time set by the father. So also, when we were children, we were in slavery under the basic prinicples of the world. But when the time had fully come, God sent His son, born of a woman born under the law, to redeem those under law, that we might receive the full rights of sons. Because you are sons, God sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts, the Spirit who calls Abba, Father. So you are no longer a slave, but a son; and since you are a son, God has also made you an heir. Gal.3:26-29; 4:1-7

    According to scripture to remain unreconciled to Christ keeps us in a place of childhood not able to enjoy fully the blessings of the Father. When we accept Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior we mature into spiritual adulthood able to partake freely in our inheritance. We can remain under the bondage of the law and sin as children; or we can enjoy the full rights, priviledges, and responsibilities as heirs of God. Jesus is Lord.

  53. SG,
    Where do you get your doctrine?
    Are you trying to convince yourself of something, or do you truly believe what you are saying?

    We are all to be children of G_d.
    When we accept Yeshua as L_rd and Savior, we are reconciled to him, and we enter his rest. That is done once and for all. Paul in his letter to the Galatians was angry with the jews that thought thay came to a saving knowledge of Yeshua, but then became enslaved by the traditions of men, through the law. They left the message of salvation and went back to the works of the flesh trying to be holy. We all know that it is not possible with out the atoning sacrifice, and that is what Paul was trying to explain to these jews. The law is the law. It is important, but, not for salvation, it is to show the great love of G_d. Why are you against his law? Don’t you understand that it shows how absolutely beautiful our L_rd is? It shows us his compassion, his passion for his creation. Because of Yeshua, the law of sin and death has been cancelled like a debt. This is true, but that is the only law that was cancelled. So we no longer would have to go and bring a burnt offering before him. But if we do not follow the law, how will we show the great love of G_d?
    We do not follow it for salvation, but for the glory of G_d. Because Yeshua cancelled the law of sin and death, we can with all the strength that Yeshua provides, lead a rich and full life in him…not lacking anything of value.
    Spiritual maturity and being a child are the same thing. Because the more spiritual you become the more childlike become, with all the wonder and joy that is wrapped up in the heart of a child. As we mature, we find that we can not do anything of value apart from him, and this is childlike faith. When my children were very little, they did not worry about the things in life that choke young people and adults today. When they are very small the only thing that matter to them is me. I become their world, and they know that I will provide all that they need to live and have their being. That is how we are to be. Totally enthralled by his majesty and grace, and strengthened with his love.
    Other wise we would not be able to reconcile what Paul says and what John says:
    Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves the father loves his child as well. This is how we know that we love the children of God: by loving God and carrying out his commands. This is love for God: to obey his commands. And his commands are not burdensome, for everyone born of God overcomes the world. This is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith. Who is it that overcomes the world? Only he who believes that Jesus is the Son of God.
    1 John 5:1-5

    and…
    How great is the love the Father has lavished on us, that we should be called children of God! And that is what we are! The reason the world does not know us is that it did not know him. Dear friends, now we are children of God, and what we will be has not yet been made known. But we know that when he appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is. Everyone who has this hope in him purifies himself, just as he is pure.
    Everyone who sins breaks the law; in fact, sin is lawlessness. But you know that he appeared so that he might take away our sins. And in him is no sin. No one who lives in him keeps on sinning. No one who continues to sin has either seen him or known him.
    Dear children, do not let anyone lead you astray. He who does what is right is righteous, just as he is righteous. He who does what is sinful is of the devil, because the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the devil’s work. No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God’s seed remains in him; he cannot go on sinning, because he has been born of God. This is how we know who the children of God are and who the children of the devil are: Anyone who does not do what is right is not a child of God; nor is anyone who does not love his brother.
    1 John 3:1-10

    We must not just look at what Paul says about the law, but we must look at why he said what he said. We need to look at the context.
    The commandments of G_d are important, and we who live by the Spirit and by faith will understand there value.

  54. SG said

    Where is the wise man? Where is the scholar? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know Him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe. Jews demand miraculous signs and Greeks look for wisdom, but we preach Christ crusified: a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles, but to those whom God has called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. For the foolishness of God is wiser than man’s wisdom, and the weakness of God is stronger than man’s strength. Brothers, think of what you were when you were called. Not many of you were wise by human standards; not many were influential; not many were of noble birth. But God chose the foolish things of the world to shame the wise God chose the weak things of the world to shame the strong. He chose the lowly things of the world and the despised things and the things that are not to nullify the things that are, so that no one may boast before him. It is because of him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become our wisdom from God that is, our righteousness, holiness and redemption. Therefore, as it is written: “Let him who boasts boast in the Lord. When I came to you, brothers, I did not come with eloquence or superior wisdom as I proclaimed to you the testimony about God. For I resolved to know nothing while I was with you except Jesus Christ and Him crucified. I came to you in weakness, and in fear, and with much trembling. My message and my preaching were not with wise and persuasive words, but with a demonstration of the Spirit’s power, so that your faith might not rest on men’s wisdom, but on God’s power. Gal. 1:20-30; 2:1-5

    Young or old, rich or poor, educated or uneducated all are welcome to become the children of God through His Son, Jesus Christ. Because we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.

  55. johnkaniecki said

    I am a little confused if Stephen is SG. I thank SG for kindly replying to my entry.

    It is obvious that such a luxury is an abuse. I would have a problem with a rich Christian business man who bought such a house let alone a preacher of the gospel. 1 Timothy 6:5 tells that godliness isn’t gain.

    Any Christian when faced with the truth will repent. Sinning and denying the truth are two different things. To lust for example is a sin. But to say that lust isn’t a sin is another matter entirely. If someone claims to follow the Word of God and then denies it then they are not trustworthy in any way.

    So when any preacher of the gospel says something two things must be examined. First of all is that is the statement in accordance with the Word of God. And the second is that person living a life that is godly.

    What would Jesus have been if He had preached what he did yet broke that same law? Could you put any trust into something like that. When I look back at the twenty years as a Christian I have been taught a lot of things by a lot of people. Now I try to remember who told me what. I find that almost all the time the people who were not genuine in their faith told me things that don’t hold up to the scrutiny of scripture.

    A preacher of the gospel who knowingly and willingly breaks that Word of God is somebody not to trust nor listen to. They may make a lot of sense but beware. The devil when tempting Jesus knew scripture and the devil twisted that to serve his own ends.

    Unfortunately these things tend not to be just one thing. If Paula White had only bought a mansion that would be bad enough. I’m afraid that is we put her under scrutiny we would find the apple is rotten.

    If you talk the talk then you have to walk the walk. We are all sinners but it is another matter to blatantly deny the truth.

    Love,

    John

  56. John Kaniecki: Made this post today with your recent request in mind, though it is somewhat different from what you asked.

    This Site Shows How To Be A Liberal Christian According To The Bible

  57. SG said

    #55 Correction: 1 Corinthians not Galatians.

    #54 Don’t be coy. Keep up now: see #47, 48, 51, 53, 55

    #56 No, I’m not Stephen, but this is a public forum, so I took my liberty in answering. I hope that doesn’t offend anyone. If so, I apologize.

    Glenn Beck is doing an interview with Joel Osteen tonight. He is going to ask Joel if he thought that Jesus would take a 15 million dollar advance if He wrote a book. Glenn says, “Oh yeah, Jesus did write a book.” Pretty clever, huh?

  58. Tina St,Ama said

    Hi, I haven’t read every entry here, but allot of it. 1st I would like to say that some of us believe that, “The Feast of Tabernacles,” is the true birthday of Yeshua, I haven’t room to tell you why, but here is a bit, that Sukkot, means hut, booth or MANGER. And the appearing of the King star at, “The feast of Trumpets,” appeared to the magi years before they actually saw Yeshua as a boy, in his house. There’s more but it’s a long teaching. As for all the sad events of Paula and so many, though it is Gods will for us to prosper and be in health, even as our soul prospers. We must be wise stewards and never frivolous, or covetous. No disciple of Yeshua was, but set examples of denying self to serve another. This is what is honorable and acceptable to Abba Father, as obedient children of Adonai. And we would bring honor to Him as we learn the way of sacrifice, instead the lust of the flesh, lust of the eyes, and the pride of life. When the people of Yeshua brought all they had and laid it at the feet of the Apostles, it was distributed as each one had a need. This practice is all but disappeared in the fellowships today, for fear of being taken advantage of. Fear of loss out weighs fear of God, and this is a tragedy. We must let our adornment be as stated in scripture, the hidden man of the heart, being revealed in living and walking in the light of truth, in modest apparel and garb. Do all things in moderation. Such a person who has wealth but doe’s not use it extravagantly on themselves but for the needs of others, is a glowing example of the sobriety of Messiah. One who is not under monies influence, but uses money advisedly, by counsel of The Spirit, and to the glory of God. Thus to show their freedom from it’s hold on them, by providing for others is indeed the way to shine as a son of righteousness in a dark greedy world. To give to the poor, downtrodden, and afflicted, has always been commendable in scripture. May it return to the Body of Yeshua in these last days, as His people awaken from their slumber in worldly pulls, which have robbed the body of Yeshua of it’s spiritual coat of many colors given to those who delight in His pleasure and presence, more than earthly, and temporary pleasures. Abba Father rise up in your special treasures, your called and chosen yet again, that all might see and say,”There He is, shining brightly in His People, filled with Grace and Truth in demonstrations of power, and the peace of Yeshua, to heal, and set at liberty them that are bruised, torn, and rejected. Thank you Father, for completing the work you have begun in each of your own sheep, as the good shepherd you attend us so very well!Amen..

  59. Tina St. Ama: Please provide your justification for believing that Jesus Christ was born on the The Feast of Tabernacles! I would love to hear it!

  60. Tina,
    Blessings to you, let me ask you a question…
    By your refering to this “spiritual coat of colors”, are you implying something? There is a popular teaching these days about Joseph and the children of Ephraim as the “new” messianic line… are you in agreement with this teaching, because you make reference to this coat. A strange wind of teaching has been blowing through the churches, and it concerns the blessings of Ephraim and Manassah and Joseph. The blessings from Jacob when he crossed his hands and blessed Ephraim as first born…
    There is much talk these days about birth order, of which I do not want to get started right now talking about, but the teachings that I have heard have just served to confuse and create a fleshy “spirit” among many believers.
    What is your position?

  61. johnkaniecki said

    Just read Rotchild timeline. See #33. My friend Rob not a believer has been trying to get me to read it for a long while. I highly recommend it.

    Thanks Ed.

    Love,

    John

  62. Charles D. said

    SG YOURS IS THE ONLY POSTING THAT IS MAKING SENSE TO ME RIGHT NOW. ALSO, AFTER READING SEVERAL OTHER POSTING ON DIFFERENT SITES; I TOO BELIEVE EDEN IS MUSLIM. IT IS A TERRIBLE THING TO DENY YOUR FAITH, OR ALLOW ANYONE/GROUP TO HIGHJACK IT.

  63. Charles D,
    Thank you for identifying me with the muslims. My heart is over joyed by your comment, because it means that I have been doing my job in glorifying Yeshua, the messiah, who is King of kings and L_rd of lords!
    If you ask G_d, he will help you to make sense of everything right now. Why draw on SG’s faith, when your faith can be increased by seeking him?
    By the way, I do not follow their prophet Muhummud or call on the mulim god, Allah. But they are still my brothers and sisters, and I long for them to come to know the love of our messiah Yeshua.
    Blessings Charles!

  64. SG said

    Good day Charles. All glory to God. Thank you for your comment. Since most of what I posted came directly from the scripture, it is easy to understand that you would be encouraged. Faith cometh by hearing and hearing by the word of God. The Gospel of Jesus Christ is the ultimate blessing and gift that everyone of us can freely give and freely receive. Even with a BA in Biblical Studies, I am still in love with this Gospel. I’m glad to hear that your faith was increased by the hearing of the greatest love story ever told. Be blessed and if you need more scripture on this topic, I would be happy to share the word. If you need assistance is receiving the gift of salvation or prayer of any kind, please don’t hesitate to ask. Ultimately, Jesus Christ is always available and can lead you by His word and spirit into all truth. Either way, be blessed.

  65. SG said

    A call for prayer. Good evening everyone. It has been an extremely challenging couple of days. The wild fires are burning all around us. Yet God has spared us. We are very grateful. Many of our neighborhoods have suffered greatly. We have been very blessed that only a few lives have been lost, but living this for so many days is beginning to wear on all of us. We need your prayers in San Diego County. Please saints of God, petition the heavenlies for a refreshing of God’s spirit, His grace, and His mercy. My home is in one of the few areas that the fire has missed. For several days, it has been like dawn all day. An orange hew covers the sky and our entire property is littered with ash and soot. God has been good to us. Please gird up our community as we get ready for the smoke to clear so we can determine our course. Thank you family of God. Success to the Kingdom, success to you.

  66. Fran said

    SG: I am standing in prayer and agreement with you for Gods’ devine protection for you and your family, and also your community during these fires, and at all times. May you be encouraged in your time of need knowing that others are standing with you. You are not alone, you have the body of Christ there, and the body of Christ some of everywhere standing with you all.

    In Christ
    Love Fran

  67. SG,
    I and my family will being praying for your family and the families effected by this horrible event. We will be praying for G_d to bless Ca. with rain. Not so much that you will get flash flooding and mud slides and not too little that it doesn’t put out the fires!
    Love
    Eden

  68. SG said

    Thank you Fran and Eden. Your support is dearly appreciated. We are well today as your prayers have strengthened our courage.

    Blessings to all,
    Susanne

  69. Charles D. said

    We prayed for the Calif fires tonight in my Bible Studies Group; and now that I can attached a name to my prayers, I will add it once more to several of the other prayer ministry groups at my church. Take courage, prayer warriors (the ferverent prayers of a rightous man/woman), as stated in the Book of James can avail much. I also pray for all of us and those that respond to your prayer request. Be Blessed.

    Charles

  70. HTL…
    I thought you would enjoy this link (maybe you already have it…it was on Joel’s site)

    http://www.cuttingedge.org/NEWS/n1818.cfm

  71. Fran said

    I hope those that are having problems following and supporting false preachers would read this article. My prayer is that the Lord allow them to receive this information into their hearts.

    Eden: I also checked out their doctrine and vision statements. Thanks for the info.

  72. johnkaniecki said

    Fran, I wanted to thank you and Rob for your comments on tongues on the Someone Explain Amillennialism.(That words a mouthful) But I coldn’t get the message to work there for some reason.

    Also let me comment on the Govenor. I have respect for everyone’s opinions and thoughts. I started to read all 12 of the Govenor’s comments on How To Survive The Last Days. Unfortuante they were a bit lenghty and somewhat confusing to me. Why I am concerned is that all the other entries were pushed off the most recently commmented section. That is how I keep up with the blogs. Can we make a rule, no more than three entries in a row on one single blog topic. This doesn’t seem grevious or unfair to me. Any ideas?

    Love,

    John

  73. Fran said

    John

    I think the Gov. slipped through. Usually her comments are diced and sliced. lol, but I did look at a little bit of her stuff.

  74. Fran said

    John,

    You can click on the Archive October 2007, then once you get there you can find any post that was posted in October. Use the previous entries once you get to Archive page. Previous entries locted right under the heading Archive for October. You”ll have to scroll the pages and continue with previous entries until you find what you’re looking for. Hope that helps.

  75. Diane said

    Fran and John, I was just about to ask you guys if we should start praying for the site after reading the unusual comments, but I see you guys have already ran across these comments.

  76. HTL says that the “Governer” is a spam that slips through every now and again.

    You would have to put an aluminum foil hat in the shape of a hersheys kiss on your head, put on your U.V. protective 3-D sunglasses, tie up your space boots, jump up and down in your underwear, making strange chicken noises while your dogs are watching and loose your mind in order for anything that the Governer says to sound sane! :)

  77. SG said

    Whewwww, what a week. It looks like the worst of the fires is over with for now. About 1800 homes burnt down, so a lot of our families will be needing our continued prayer. It is sad to hear that some of these wild fires were started by arson. This brought to mind some things.

    Just like natural wild fires are used to cleanse the wildnerness from time to time, God will allow the fire of the Holy Ghost to cleanse our Christian community. On the other side, when fires are purposefully set they do not cleanse they devastate. When people start wild fire gossip thinking they are helping God to cleanse the church, this too is devastating. It is arson and it enjoys destroying people, homes, communities, and good Christian leaders. In exposing ministry abuses, it is one thing to have first hand knowledge and experience of ministerial abuse and it is quite another to have a personal vendetta against a particular move of God to satisfy the urge to “watch something burn.”

    It is our calling to preach the gospel, not to take vengeance on something we may know nothing about. Our primary focus should be on reporting the Good News, not on just spreading destructive material to validate a murderous and destructive spirit. Just like good fire men, we can tell the difference between the natural course of fire and the destrutive force of arson. Just some thoughts.

  78. stevoyo said

    I have found this discussion to be very interesting. And while I am not in opposition to exposing false teachings, I was very disturbed by the misleading statement “Jesus Christ is your Sabbath Rest” in post #11.

    I can’t help but wonder how long many in the Christian world will continue to find a reason to break the Law of God by doing surgery to the 10 commandments and removing the fourth commandment to group it with the law of Moses in order to declare it has been done away with! To state that Hebrews says that Jesus supplants the 4th commandment Sabbath is horribly misleading and such a declaration cannot stand up to any serious scriptural scrutiny.

    This faulty reasoning is somehow deducted from Hebrews 3 and 4. But careful reading of this passage excludes any conclusion that the author was attempting to supplant the 4th commandment Sabbath with the reality found in Christ, for indeed the Word of God in its entirety shows no contradiction or competition between the two. The author of Hebrews plainly, clearly, unmistakably is trying to explain that the Rest he is describing was available to both the Old Covenant Jews and to New Covenant Christians, “For the Gospel was preached unto them as well as unto us” Heb 4:2. A simple study on topic reveals the rest of this Gospel is distinct from the 4th commandment Sabbath. This Gospel rest in discussion was first promised in Deuteronomy 12:8,9. “Ye shall not do after all the things that we do here this day, every man whatsoever is right in his own eyes. For ye are not as yet come to the rest and to the inheritance, which the Lord your God giveth you.” The rest God was offering Israel here was a dual rest 1: Rest from all their enemies round about (verse 10), 2: Rest from their own works, “doing whatsoever is right in his own eyes” (verse 8). Under Joshua Israel attained to the rest in the first sense here described (rest from their enemies) by the power of God (Jos 21:44, 22:4). But as the author of Hebrews is describing, Israel failed to enter in the God’s rest in the second sense, for in Joshua’s time some in the camp had strange gods (Joshua 24:23), and after Joshua and the elders died, the people refused to serve the Lord any longer and turned to Baalim (Judges 2:7-13). Finally Judges 17:6 and Judges 21:25 declare that once again “every man did that which was right in his own eyes”. “For if Joshua had given them rest, then would He not afterward have spoken of another day. There remains therefore a rest to the people of God. For he that is entered into His rest, he also has ceased from his own works, as God did from His” Heb 4:8-10. Notice that the author very plainly states that there “remains… a rest” signifying that this rest that he was describing to the early Christian church is not a new rest but rather an old one, but those to whom it was first offered “could not enter [into it] because of unbelief” Heb 3:19. The seventh-day Sabbath described in verse 4 in the forth chapter of Hebrews is being employed to help the readers understand the Gospel rest. As God ceased from His works on the 7th day because He found rest in His relationship with mankind, so we are to cease from our dead works and find rest in the relationship we find in Christ through His Gospel. Though the gospel came to the Israelites in a different form the result was to be same in both Old and New Covenants… circumcision of the Heart (Deut 10:16, Rom 2:29), resting from evil works to serve the living God and keep His commandments. “For the hearers of the law are not just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified” Romans 2:13. Paul speaking of this rest in his personal life declares, “I am crucified with Christ; nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith of the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself fore me.” Galatians 2:20.

    Now I would ask, “did God make a mistake by grouping the Sabbath commandment with, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not Steal, Thou shalt have no other gods before Me?” Is it insignificant that God spoke 10 commandments and wrote them in immutable stone with His own finger and placed them within the Ark, while Moses spoke to Israel the Ceremonial and Civil laws, and wrote them down himself on perishable parchment and placed them without the Ark of the covenant? How long will it be convenient for us to despise teachings of Christ who taught early Christians to value the Sabbath by praying that their flight from the besieged Jerusalem in 70 AD would not occur on the Sabbath, “Pray that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the Sabbath day”(Matthew 24:20)? How long should we ignore the example of Christ, the apostles, and the early church in hallowing God’s sanctified rest day (Luke 4:16, Acts 16:13, Acts 17:2, Acts 13:42)? Behold Christ visiting the Apostle John who was keeping the Sabbath on the Isle of Patmos, “I was in the Spirit on the Lord’s day, and heard behind me a great voice…” (Rev 1:10). Some claim that this citation of the “Lord’s day” here is referring to Sunday, but there is not one single passage in all of Scripture to support this claim, while there is a ton of verses that confirm that this “Lord’s day” is undoubtedly the 4th commandment Sabbath (Exodus 16:23, 20:10; Isaiah 58:13; Mark 2:28, to name a few).

    Beloved, There is a difference between the Ceremonial laws of the Old Testament and God’s 10 commandment law. Notice the dichotomy in the Apostle Paul’s mind, “Circumcision is nothing, an uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.” (1 Cor 7:19). This dichotomy between the two laws (one temporal one eternal) dwelt in the mind of Christ and the Jews in Jesus’ day. Debating with the Pharisees on Sabbath observance in John 7:22 – 24, Jesus explains that since the Jews who sometimes broke God’s 4th commandment by circumcising a boy on the Sabbath in order “that the law of Moses should not be broken” and yet did not consider it a crime, how much more should He be able to heal and do good works on the Sabbath without being condemned. The strength of Christ’s point here is that both He and the Jews agreed that the law of Moses was separate and distinct from the law of God, and that doing good works is further from breaking the Sabbath commandment than circumcising a boy on the Sabbath in order to uphold the lesser temporal law of Moses.

    In conclusion I cite the warning of Christ from the mount of blessing, “Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.” (Matthew 5:19). Let us indeed rest from our own works and from doing what is right in our own eyes and follow the teachings of Christ.

  79. I would have to disagree with you on that SG.
    Although there are natural fires and fires set in place by arsons, there is still the fact that those who choose to place them selves in the line of fire will always run the risk of getting burned. This too is a fact.

  80. Stevoyo,
    Thank you for your comments, they lifted and refreshed my soul. Be blessed, and I hope that you will continue to leave your comments.

    Eden

  81. SG said

    Hi Eden,

    That okay that you disagree. I’m confident that my statement is worth pondering. I’ll continue to go with it, if that is okay with you?

    sg

  82. Beautiful Susanne!
    How are you and your family doing? Give us a report, because out here, they do not talk about it anymore on the news…not that I can really depend on the media for anything anyway. ;)

    Tell us of the great things the L_rd has been doing out there.

    And yes, it is ok that we disagree…but I didn’t completely disagree with you, and I should have stated that. Sorry. It was more of an adding to what you said. Forgive me.
    Anyway, I hope you and your family are safe, and may the Lord’s hand continue to be upon you through this time.

    Love
    Eden

  83. SG said

    Hi sister Eden. Sorry, I haven’t written back until now. We’ve been real busy trying to get back to normal.

    I took my dog out for a ride to the desert last Friday for a day of four wheeling at Ocotillo. We drove down the 76 and witnessed a lot of the damage from the Poomacha fire in and around the La Jolla Indian Reservation. Power and phone lines were still down. There were still hot spots around. We ran into several fire fighters taking a break. They were covered in soot and ash looking very tired, but having a positive attitude. On the way home we stayed on the 78 up through Julian. On one side the trees were cascading over the mountainess roads with their bright orange and yellow leaves illuminating our path. It was beautiful. Further down the road through Julian, Santa Ysabel, and Ramona, we saw devastation. There were many land marks that I’ve been used to seeing completely destroyed. Old homes and cottage style properties just gone. It made me weep. I ride through these areas on my Harley a lot and have enjoyed the beautiful surroundings for many years. I’ll miss it all.

    My love and prayers to everyone in these mountain towns. Thank you for letting me come to visit. I really enjoyed the fruit bars at Dudley’s Bakery. The bread pudding was awesome. My husband ate the whole thing. We love you neighbors. God bless you all.

  84. Charles D. said

    Eden: Am I understanding correctly that you celebrated Ramadan?

    Charles

  85. edenhadassah said

    Charles:

    I don’t celebrate Ramadan, I am not a muslim. Although, I think that I would like to try some of the food that they prepare for Ramadan. The beauty of muslim art, and many of their other contributions to the world have always facinated me. I think that they as a people deserve respect and appreciation for how they have shaped the world we now live in. They have their problems, and some have gone off the deep end, but I guess I could never bring my self to throw out the baby with the bath water.
    When I was younger, my father took me to the Metropolitan Museum Of Art specifically to see the artistry of Arabic writing. I was taken back by the beauty of the work, and I was hesitant at the same time because I didn’t know what I was looking at. I didn’t know what the words meant that made up the different peices of art.
    Then, about a year ago, my daughter came home from school, with the cover of a National Geographic Issue. She ripped the cover off to bring home and show me. She was startled by the fact that the woman on the cover, had the same exact eyes as mine. She thought looking at this woman’s eyes was like looking at her mother’s eyes. When she brought it home, she showed me, and I turned away with tears in my eyes. It was like I was looking in a “soulful mirror.” My husband saw it, and his mouth dropped. I put the picture away because it was too unnerving to look into eyes that all my life only saw in a mirror. I believe this woman on the cover was a Saudi. She was dressed in a white linen head covering with only her eyes showing. If I find it on line, I will link it. Anyway, although I had always had respect for them, now I felt this strange connection to them as well…in my flesh.

  86. Charles D. said

    Yes, I heard you and I know just what you mean; wink,wink! :~}

    Charles

  87. Diane said

    Eden,

    Do you think perhaps the Lord was giving you a heart for the Saudi women for a possible future outreach? As I read your comment, I tried to put myself in your position of how I would have felt, and it just seemed like a possible call. I don’t know Muslim food, or art, but some of the scarves are beautiful.

  88. It is interesting that you say that Diane, and I do believe that it was given to me for muslim women, but even more than that, I grew up in a very racist home. My extended family are all very racially bigoted on my father’s side, and growing up, I was taught a deep suspicion and even hatred for blacks, arabs, chinese, russians, jews (believe it!) and so on. My father had a great disgust of Indians and chinese and would constantly rail against their “driving abilities” and way with business. My grandfather and his family escaped persecution by denying our heritage and saying it was better to be a “good German” than a “dirty jew.” But towards the end of my grandfather’s life he told me of my family heritage and asked forgiveness. All our concepts of hatred came from my grandfather, and also from my father’s mother, who herself was came from a family of jews from Naples Italy. She denied being jewish and my grandfather being jewish strongly, because she was brought up during a time of survival. But the paper trail of my family is undeniable. My grandmother on my father’s side had a problem with my mother who was from a French and Filapino Saphardic jewish family. Both my mother’s mother and my mother’s father were French and Filapino Sephards. Can you imagine the conflict for my father’s mother?
    So there has always been deep bigotry with in my family. My father said when I was younger that if I ever dated a black man I would be disowned. And if I ever dated an Indian man, he would shoot himself! Without understanding where these issues stemmed from. That is until my grandfather set the record straight. During that time, my father accepted the Lord, and repented of most of his bigotry…but some of it still remains. When I accepted the Lord twenty years ago, I repented of all my personal bigotry. Even though my father was a bigot, he was an artist and taught me to respect other artists and their work. It was his only concession in bigotry. My bigotry was entirely toward’s Indian people. After many personal experiences with them, which were very negative, I believed my father was right about them. But when I came to the Lord, I repented, out of a lack of understanding and fear, that if I didn’t repent, that the Lord would send me to India to live and die! I know it sounds crazy, but that was my logic at the time. I had heard so many stories like that, and my hatred was so deep, that I tried to snap out of it, and thought that I could simply repent. But as I was getting to know the Lord, I realized that he doesn’t work that way, and that my repentance was vanity and self-preservation. So I repented of that, and asked the Lord to begin to bring Indian men and women into my life that I could build relationships with. It was repentance in action. The Lord flooded my life with Indian men and women, and I fell in love with them. Then I begged the Lord to let me go to India and live among them, and he shut that door tight. I still would love to go, and maybe someday I will, but for now, my place is here.
    I have spent the last twenty years of my life undoing what my grandfather did for so long. My children do not have any hatred towards others nor do they stereotype them. When I married a jewish man who was also a believer, it took a long time for my father’s family to warm up to him, and then they fell in love with him. My marriage brought more skeletons out of our family closet, and helped many of my family members to heal from the scarring effects of bigotry.

  89. Diane said

    Eden,

    as you were sharing your story, the Lord brought to my mind a man, I think he might be a politician (can’t remember), but he told a story about his life that sounded similar to what you described. I believe this gentleman didn’t find out he was Jew until he was an adult. It’s hard to remember all the details, but from what I remember, with tears his mother told him that they had to change their last name for survival reasons. I think the Grandfather was a prominent and successful watchmaker and was sent to prison for being Jewish; thus the reason for the name change. When this mother told her son this, she mentioned something about being either ashamed or angry, but he was neither, he was greatful for his heritage. I cried as I watched this on one of the news stations.

    I’m not sure if it was the Arab women or the women from India, but the colorful long scarves are beautiful.

  90. Eden Hadassah said

    Diane,

    I struggled with my family over this as well. My maiden last name is a german jewish last name, and in school, they would say…”Are you jewish? You don’t look jewish!” I knew my mother’s heritage, yet that too wasn’t talked about, so I would just say no. The picture that most people have in their mind’s when a person says “jewish looking” is someone of Russian, Polish features. Like many of the jewish actors or people with the last name like Stein, Rosenberg, Heim, and many of the Orthodox Rabbi’s etc. Some one with a very fair complexion, prominent nose, eyes close together…
    I don’t look like them. Even though I have many nationalities, some how I still look middle eastern. Go figure. I have Italian, German, French and Filapino, yet I don’t look like any of those either.

  91. Israel "Izzy" said

    Sha-Loha (Shalom & Aloha) Y’all. Happy Hanukkah Eden “Testament/Agreement/Covenant” – Hadassah. Great site…great thoughts…great interaction…GREAT SOURCE OF ENCOURAGMENT!! Blessings to you & your families. ALOHA…A hui hou (Hawai’ian: ‘Till then, ALOHA’)

  92. Blessings of Messiah Yeshua Tzedkenu to all!!!
    Can some fellow-believer(Holy Spirit Filled)enlighten me as to when we Gentiles have followed Yeshua(Jesus’) mandate to provoke the Jewish people to spiritual jealousy as the Bible mandates(not suggests)??? Also, wondered what Yeshua meant when He stated “Salvation comes through the Jews? When did Yeshua become a Gentile? When did His Jewish Apostles convert to a new religion/faith that Yeshua stated He came to start? Did Yeshua change His mind when not as many Jewish people came to faith in Him as Almighty ABBA”s son??? Did Yeshua not say He came only for the lost sheep of the house of Israel? These questions are meant as sincere and thought provoking in His Love and for His Glory!!! We Gentile believers need to do our history homework… Google or read about “The First Church of Jerusalem. All 120 Holy Spirit filled believers were Jews! The next 3000 saved were Jews! The 5000 added shortly thereafter Jews! Jewish(Messianic) and Gentiles worshipped together into the late 400 A.D. time period…This was before the church turned from God’s living organism to an Intimidate,manipulate & control the masses organization.(Which kicked Messianic believing Jews out of the church for selfesh gains! Don’t believe me,read it for yourself in Foxes Book of Martyrs,or any other resource you
    are led by God to choose to educate yourself on the herrific unBiblical faith that our ‘church fathers instituted. Suggestion : Start by googling Justyn Martyr,Iraneus, Augustine,John Crysostom(“Golden Mouth”),Bernard ofClairvaux,,Pope Innocent 111,Peter the Venerable, King Ferdinand & Queen Isabella of Spain, The Inquisitions,Martin Luther,the Russian Pogroms against the Jews,Adolph Hitler,and so many other so called “Christians” who have persecuted the “Christ-Killing” Jews. The Bible tells us to “Love our neighbor and pray for our enemies”…Did we show the Jews we disagreed with Love? After all Yeshua stated(And He can’t lie),”I lay my life down freely,no-one takes it from me.”We wonder why most Jewish people object to a faith whose “God allowed them to by their own will judge and persecute their relative over the last 2000+ years?
    If you read Ephesians Ch. 2:11-22 you will hear Yeshua explain how He died so Jew & Gentile could be one in Him.” John(Yohannan)Ch.17:21 states ” I pray Father that they may be one as we are one.” Who is Jesus speaking about? There were no Baptists,Evangelicals,Church of the Nazarene’s around then…Just JEWS and GENTILES!!!We need to repent to the Jewish people worldwide for the sins of those who called themselves by the name of Christ,but helped the advesary make much of the Christian faith abhorent. Yes, we deviated from God’s original pattern. We by Yeshua’s death,burial & ressurection have His (Chesed) Grace/unmerited favor,yet we must still walk after Him in Holiness…”Be ye Holy,as I am Holy” He said!!! Stop the “we’re under Grace(as an excuse) lie of Ha satan!Do you know why Moses and Elijah were on the mount of transfiguration with Jesus? He did not come to abolish the Law or the Prophets but to fulfill them”(fill them full). This does not mean the Moral law(inclusive of Torah), or the Prophets was excreted…Just the laws man added,ceremonial and dietary laws were… Why did (Father,Son & Holy Ghost), choose the Jewish Feast of the LORD(Deut.Ch.23),to die on? Why was He put in thbe rich man’s grave(Yosef of Aramathea on the Jewish Feast/Rehersal/set time of the LORD on Unleavened Bread? Why did He rise from the dead on the Hebrew feast of FirstFrits(Easter/See Ishtar-pagan Babalonian goddess)?, Why after 40 days of meeting with His Talmidim(followers) to
    teach them all they needed to know to evangelize the Jew (Rom. Ch.1:16 1st) and then the Gentile world with the good news,then tell His Jewish Apostles to wait 10 days in Jerusalem for the Holy Spirit which when it came would bring power from on High(Heaven)? This is the same thing that happened when God married Israel at Mount Sainai to those with eyes and ears and hearts to receive God! (Thunder,lightning,Fire and God’s voice were heard by believers in YHVH Sabaoath!!! Jesus told the Jews”I bwill not return until YOU say Baruch Haba Basceh Adonai”Blesse is He(Jesus),who come’s in the name of the LORD” This bride needs work in it’s loving and provoking the Jews to jealousy!!! Then Yeshua will return as He said He would. The sign/miracle the Jews need to see is our true LOVE for them and all mankind. The miracle of Love,combinbed with the miracle of our persoinal salvation testimony is a start fdor the Holy Spirit to begin working in Jewish hearts!!!
    In His Ahab(Love),
    Robert & Family

  93. P.S. Romans Ch.’s 9-11 are not a codisil in our Bibles. The WHOLE Bible is God’s word!!! Rav Shaul(Paul) explains how we Gentiles are grafted into the commonwealth of Israel. Paul states “Not all the branches were cut off.”Paul goes on to say “The root supports you,you Gentiles do not support the root” Paul tells us not to become boastful or arrogant against the natural branches of Israels olive Tree that we draw sap from…
    Robert Rosati Family

  94. Job said

    Robert Rosati:

    What does beauty and bands of Zechariah 11:7 mean? Beauty is the Jewish church, bands is the Gentile church. That is my opinion. Now I agree with most of what you say. However, I admonish you not to be too harsh on Luther, Irenaeus, Golden – Tongue, and some of the others. I concede that the allegorists and the Neo – Platonists took things too far though. We have to work together to deliver Christians of all stripes from false doctrines, but our primary job is to spread the Great Commission and then to love one another!

  95. Charles D. said

    Mr. Rosati:

    I would not dare take up everything you have asked, but maybe, if I take up a small chunck, it might be beneficial to both of us. I am certainly not aware of the mandate you mentioned:
    “Can some fellow-believer(Holy Spirit Filled)enlighten me as to when we Gentiles have followed Yeshua(Jesus’) mandate to provoke the Jewish people to spiritual jealousy as the Bible mandates(not suggests)??? Also, wondered what Yeshua meant when He stated “Salvation comes through the Jews”

    My Bible reads that God said HE was going to do that. God is God all by Himself, and He doesn’t need my little poor imperfected self messing up what He Himself has started AND will finish.

    Allowing for the fact that He may very well use me (one who considers himself a believer in God and my Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ), to accomplish His devine purpose, but it is not a mandate. Matter of factly, I find very little in the OT that God has mandated a believer to do, except the Big 10, which He re-codify in the NT. God speaks it and it is done! Period! He doen’t wait for us to make up our minds when we will dp it, or even if we will do it. Much like He Told Isaiah to tell the King of Assyria, “I WILL PUT MY HOOK IN YOUR NOSE AND MY BIT IN YOUR TONGUE, AND TURN YOU….” Once God speaks it is a done deal. Believe it. We can do it the easy way or we can do the “hook in the nose thing, but make no doubt about it, His will be done.

    I can help but comment on your vast useage of language, especially, in your salutation and your complimentary closing. I was convicted in my spirit and thought: “But how can we understand if we have no one to teach us” The mostbase of readers and commenters here are not so steeped in the language as you have used it. Why would one cause his brother to stumble or spend time deciphering the style when it is the only substance that matter.

    I dare say that if you spent a fraction of the time – dealing with what God actually said, mandated, or dictated, then many more of your sisters and brothers would benefit from your contribution.

    Now, if you could point me to the exact scripture where the mandate which you make reference, I will not only owe you a spiritual apology, I will offer one, with the full assurance that it will be accepted and which is one of the very basic mandates from God.

    To you and your family I wish you His blessings.

    Charles

  96. Robert said

    Greetings brother Charles in the name of Yeshua!!!(that was, is, and will be)Messiah’s Holy name forever. His name means God’s Salvation in the Hebrew language God gave to Abraham, Issac(Yitzak), and Jacob(Ya’acov), who are patriachs to both Jews and Christians alike. Their God and our God are the same. The difference is they do not believe the Messiah is coming for the 2nd time,rather they(observant Orthodox Jews) believe it’s His 1st time coming…
    To answer your question regarding where the Bible states the mandate (not suggestion),that we Gentile believers are to “Provoke them(Jewish non-believers) to Jealousy” is in the Book of Romans CH.11 vs 11.The non-believing portion of the Jews (which Historically were not as many as you or I may initially
    have been taught to believe via Roman-Greco teaching,Charles.
    In putting forth the questions in the Love of ECHAD(Father,Son and Holy Spirit),as HE led, the purpose was not to make anyone stumble in the faith. The purpose was to share with whomever God leads to ask questions for mutual edification,growth and give
    glory to God by iron sharpening iron-(Proverbs 27:17). This way we build each other up and learn and grow in His Love from each other. Humbly I apologize if anything expressed has caused you Charles, or any other believer harm. In regard to the Biblical truth on “Salvation comes through the Jews”(John, Yohannan CH.4vs22), are you stating that I suggest God needs our help to do that or anything else? God needs no help,your absolutely correct. God does need for us to know what that means to Him and to us so we may hear and obey Him, would you agree? We were grafted into the believing portion of the Hebrew/Jewish faith. The name “Christ”(Greek-”Christos”) translates as Messiah in the original Hebrew/Aramaic of which in addition to the Greek Septuigent was written by Jews of that day into the Hebrew language as well. Jesus, the Jewish Apostles and disciples as well as the Gentile believers all utilized the “Old Testament/First Testament)to witness to non-believers as the New Testament was not written until approximately 50 A.D.. Charles, how can we read a Jewish Book given to us by God,through a Roman-Greco perspective and be sure we understand the Holy scriptures to the extent God intended? An example could be the word peace in English which means “order”,”freedom from dissension” etc. In Hebrew peace/shalom means(hello,good-bye,wholeness,wellness well-being,harmony and SALVATION).In psalm 122 vs 6 we are told to(not suggested to), “Pray for the peace of Jerusalem”-(SALVATION of the Jews)?).In regard to the “Big 10″Charles inference to God’s Holy commandments there are 613 commandments. No we can’t keep all the Moral law therefore Yeshua’s blood atonement was given freely in His Love and Grace for our sins.Romans CH.7vs12 states ” So the Law is Holy,and the command(Commandments),is Holy and right and good.” Psalm 19 vs7-11 state,” The teachings of the LORD are perfect, they give new strength. The rules of the LORD can be trusted they make plain people wise. The oders of the LORD are right; they make people happy. The commands of the LORD are pure; they light up the way. Respect for the LORD is good; it will last forever. The judgements of the LORD are true; they are completely right. They are worth more than gold, even the purest gold. They are sweeter than honey, even the finest honey. By them your servant is warned keeping them brings great reward.” The Apostle (Peter/Kefa) in 2nd Peter 1:19-21 states “This [hearing God's voice during Jesus transfiguration 2 Peter 1:18] makes us more sure about the message the Prophets gave. It is good for you to follow closely what they said as you would follow a light shining in a dark place, until the day begins and the morning stars rises in your hearts. Most of all you must understand this; no prophecy in the Scriptures ever comes form the Prophets own interpretation. No prophecy ever came from what a person wanted to say, but people lead by the Holy Spirit spoke words from God.” Since the WHOLE Bible is the Word of God Charles(2nd Tim:3:16)-”All Scripture is God breathed and is valuable for teaching the truth,convicting of sin,correcting faults and training in right living;thus anyone belonging to God may be fully equipped for every good work”,including the 1st Testament which Jesus,the Apostles and Prophets all used and has not passed away,rather The Old Testament is The New Testament Concealed(Type & Shadow-God’s Salvation Plan for Man), and The New Testament is The Old testament revealed.You will as any other Holy-spirit filled brother or sister find as you search the Scriptures, their Spiritual relevance and truth in the plan that God gave us to study,share,learn and grow from together in His Love.Since Obedience is the highest form of worship according to the
    LORD”If you Love me keep my commands”, “Be ye Holy as I Am Holy.”We must walk after HIM,in Love and obedience to all His commands. It is HE (ADONAI) who told this follower to pray Unceasingly,study to find thyself approved a workman ready to answer questions and lovingly encourage others to seek HIM with all their heart,mind,soul and resources,as HE expects from this servant also. Hope some of your questions were answered brother Charles. Did make a true effort to lovingly share what HE has put on me to share. All explainations were backed by solid Scriptural references tonight,as spending time only on what God
    actually stated in His Holy Word. He is Lovely!!! Perhaps He will chastize me for long-windness.Zeal for God is where it is at !!! Bless You Brother!!! You encouraged this servant of our LORD to try and more fully explain and back up all statements made with specific and exact Scripture. After all, it’s all about Him!!! More on The Hebrew Roots of Christianity can be searched out at http://www.hmmin.com(Dr. Howard Morgan),Zola Levitt Ministries.com,www.Bridgesforpeace.com,www.icnministries.org(Dr. Michael Brown), or by Googling Dr. Marvin Wilson(Professor of Judeo-Christian Studies-Gordon College,Wenham Mass.).Be Blessed!!!
    Robert

  97. Robert said

    Shalom Job!
    Thank you for both your positive and reproving comments regarding last evenings email to Brother Charles. Sometimes this imperfect warrior’s over-zealousness for sharing what God has put on this Gentile believers heart is in need of prayers that demonstrate more clarity and love in explainations. Also need to cite all expressed to others with specific Scriptural proofs in His Love demonstrating Galations CH.5:22 at all times.It is time for our evening Daven.In Humble appreciation brother Iyov!
    Blessed be Haguvarah!!!
    Robert

  98. Job said

    Robert:

    I am unaware that our discourse was in reference to anything that Brother Charles said, but I took it to be a standalone exchange between you and myself.

  99. Charles D. said

    Robert, please know that my comments of February 13th had nothing whatsoever to do with the discourse between you and Job; cross-fertilization will only confuse the three of us.

    While I truly admire the zeal by which you apparently wish to “instruct” and I find no hostile intent in your comments, however, I do find error in your interpretation of scripture. Further complicating matters, is your over-working of rhetorical questions as a teaching tool, when attempting to make a point, or to clarify. I will get to this point in greater detail further down.

    First, I disagree that Roman 11:11 is a mandate for Christians to provoke Jews to jealousy. As I stated yesterday, provoking Jews to jealousy was an accomplished act at the self-same hour that the engrafting of the “wild olive branches along with the olive branch” into the true Vine was accomplished. It was already a done deal before Paul spoke the words contained at v11:11 which by commonly acceptable interpretation mean that:

    [Paul had a vision for a church where all Jews and Gentiles would be united in their love of God and in obedience to Christ. While respecting God’s Law, this ideal church would look to Christ alone for salvation. One’s background and social status would be irrelevant (see Galatians 3:28) - what mattered would be one’s faith in Christ.

    Paul’s vision has yet to be realized. Many Jewish people rejected the Good News (as do many Gentiles, then, as well as today). The Jews depended on their heritage for salvation, and they did not have the “heart of obedience” that was so important to the OT prophets and to Paul. Once Gentiles became dominant in most Christian churches, they began rejecting Jews and even persecuting them. Unfortunately, this practice has recurred through the centuries

    True Christians should not persecute others, period! Both Christians and Jews have done so much to damage the cause of the God they claim to serve that Paul’s vision often seems impossible to fulfill. Yet God chose the Jews, just as He chose the Christians, and He is still working to unite Jew and Christian in a new Israel, a new Jerusalem, ruled by His Son.]

    You asked: “Charles, how can we read a Jewish Book given to us by God, through a Roman-Greco perspective and be sure we understand the Holy scriptures to the extent God intended?”

    My flip response is: First, be sincere in your pursuit of spiritual wisdom, then, pick up the Book, open it, and depend more on the Holy Spirit’s revelation, then on ““Start by goggling:” as you have stated in another place in your comments. Goggle is fine and certainly there is both, a time and place to “goggle,“ however, not as a substitute or as a short-cut to biblical study, knowledge, or wisdom.

    May you continue to grow in His grace and wisdom.

    Charles

  100. Robert said

    Bless You Brother!!! Would Jesus treat me w/sarcasim as you are? Thats o.k. I’ll shake the dust off and move on where I may share in His Love… May you study dilligently Charles! Your Biblical knowledge is…No,Bless you!!! Goodbye May His Holy Spirit(not the same as the spirit of religion)keep and enlighten you!!! Robert
    Servant of EL ELYON (God of Israel)believing Jews & engrafted Gentiles-(Romans. Ch.’s 9-11,Eph.2:11-22,JN.17:21, Rev.22,7&12

  101. Robert said

    Shalom Job!
    Did not intend offense toward you. Am moving on from this website to serve,share and learn elsewhere…Blessings and goodbye.Sincerely,
    Robert

  102. Charles D. said

    Robert:

    It is truly unfortunate if you viewed my comments as “sarcasim” directed towards you. I was hopeful that, since we were discussing scripture, you would have used your spiritual vision. Lacking that, at a minimum I would certainly expect someone with the “love” you have expressed for Christ, to make/take a stand, and if you believe what you’ve said so for; then contend for what you believe, more importantly, what you believe in.

    Certainly, I apologize if I offemded your sensibilities. But I for one, do not believe in running away from or running to ideas that differ from my own. This is not my site, you really don’t have to leave on my account.

    To you, also – Be blessed

    Charles

  103. Charles D. said

    Robert:

    To insure that I had not said anything to you that could possibly be interpreted as sarcasm, I am confident that I have not done such a thing to date. At first, (and only because you attempted to intertwine Job’s and my comments to you as of one thesis), I thought there might be room for the confusion. At quick re-look at what you originally wrote does not support that line of thinking or your reasoning. You invited any and every believer to enlighten you:

    “Blessings of Messiah Yeshua Tzedkenu to all!!!
    Can some fellow-believer(Holy Spirit Filled)enlighten me as to when we Gentiles have followed Yeshua(Jesus’) mandate to provoke the Jewish people to spiritual jealousy as the Bible mandates(not suggests)???

    If you want to leave this site, which in my opinion have helped many; well that’s entirely up to you. HOWEVER, if as a parting shot you want to leave a veil of guilt and feign a false reason for doing so, then, that not only speaks to your original motive for stopping by here, it speaks volumes about whom you really love, and even more about your character.

    Charles

  104. Eden Hadassah said

    Robert,
    Although I do not have time to properly address your comments right now, I would like you to seriously consider what you have been taught about the “jewish people.”
    I have noticed that you separate yourself out by calling yourself a “gentile”, when in Yeshua, there is neither jew nor gentile.
    In answering your question about making jews jealous, the answer is that we are all one. There is no distinction when you have accepted Yeshua as the Messiah. This fact drives them up the wall with jealousy, and drives them nuts, because they boast in their flesh that they alone “have a special covenant”. And while there is a covenant with the jewish people, gentiles have been grafted in as adopted sons and daughters, which means that they too can share in their Messiah’s joy.

    Further, I would like you to also consider that I am not talking about “supersession” or “replacement theology”, but do understand that there is plenty of that going on within jewish circles as it is. Their whole argument is “who is a jew?” and they reject even one another based upon the flesh and whether someone’s mother was jewish or the types of clothing one wears and even the color of one’s skin…it is all external, void of the circumcision of the heart. Those who are jewish, like myself, who come to the Lord, continue on in the beautiful covenant that the Lord does have with his people, but this covenant is so much more vibrant and fragrant knowing that we are forever joined together through the precious blood of Yeshua our Messiah! How sublime to know the fullness of our Lord, and to be able to share this with one another in fellowship. It makes the covenant that much sweeter, that much more precious.
    I wish I had more time this evening, and all this week I will be pretty busy, but if I have a moment, I will be back to finish addressing your comments.
    I have some links to give, but I don’t have the time right now to put them together…so if you are still around in a few days, pop back in, and they will be waiting for you.

    Be blessed,
    Eden

  105. johnkaniecki said

    Eden,

    It was so nice to see your entry on the blog. I have been reading the blogs a lot and not being moved to respond. I like to check in from time to time like this to let everyone know I am out there and keeping up on things.

    I am interested in these so called “special delegates” in the Democratic party.

    Love,

    John

  106. Charles D. said

    Hey My Fruitcake:
    You say with such ease what I think and you say it without the sentimental baggage that I bring to almost every discourse. Cept’n if I were to talk about ” “special delegates” in the Democratic party,” or some such nonesense that doesn’t belong here! Oh! sorry. Hi John; didn’t see you pop in. :)

  107. prosperity said

    wow!!! i’m 16 years old and i just want to say thati watch the show all the time and record it i use to think to be saved and preaching the word of god you had to be old.but i was wrong really wrong god put it in my heart to bring ppl to him and i use the notes i learn from you and my church to help me help others.

  108. Prosperity – If you want to please the Lord, turn your TV off, never watch Paula White again and read your Bible instead. Start at 1 Timothy 6.

  109. Roger said

    That is the problem! We shouldnt be afraid of these megapreachers…Yeshua was the one who died for us! They only care about collecting millions of dollars to own private jets like Benny Hinn; they live in big manssions and they act as if they were the ones holding the key of salvation for the rest of mankind. Stop “idolizing” these people! Open your eyes and go back to your Bibles! They are not a special “caste” they are fallible human beings who have been making lots of bucks thanks to ignorance!

  110. Randy said

    Who is Paula White?

  111. AdinoEznite said

    Back to the original subject, these are from the original article:

    “WHY ARE YOU FOLLOWING THEM? I will give you the answer … either because you are deceived or because you are reprobates like they are. Which is it? ”

    Actually, I had no idea she had made any such statements since I’ve never heard of her until recently. A better answer to the question is neither b/c someone is deceived nor a reprobate, they’ve maybe never heard an opposing viewpoint.

    “Is she asking her followers to send her live animals such as the bull, goat, sheep, and ram instead? ”

    Is it ok to send her a squirrel?
    What about a “Squirrel-On-A-Stick”?
    Shoulda bought a “Squirrel-On-A-Stick” when I had the chance.

  112. AdinoEznite said

    Who is Paula White?
    She is or is soon to be the ex-wife of Randy White. They were preachers from up north that started a ministry. Had nothing to start with.

    After they got money, the money got them. Rumors of affairs. Ripping off supporters. Typical route of unchecked power.

    Their failure at keeping their marriage together has nothing to do with infidelity, which they claim. Ok, let’s take them at their word.

    So, they’re getting divorced for non-scriptural reasons. This disqualifies them both as preachers, leaders, etc..

    Wait for the fallout.

    There’s an old saying, “give the devil enough rope and eventually it’ll hang itself.”

    And, “Time heals all wounds, and wounds all heels.”

  113. Wow…
    I love Pastor Paula White and her Ministry, and I know that she does love the Lord Jesus Christ with all her heart, soul, and mind.
    When I get to heaven I know that I will see her, because I know that she is a believer.

  114. Scott said

    Has anyone considered what the great Apostle Paul told the Galatians? if he or anyone, including an angel delivered another gospel they were to be anathema (damned to hell)… hmmmm… and is Paula White guilty of that?

  115. [...] Posted by Job on May 28, 2007 Update: see Paula White Claims That Jesus Christ Died In Vain! [...]

  116. ron rankin said

    what!??! i feel very sorry for you! god help you!!!

  117. satan's Double Trouble GOD'S friend said

    Yes we are our brother’s keeper. However, when we go to give correction, we must do it with a pure heart and in LOVE, not with name calling or other purposefully hurtful words. Just tell it like it is without embellishing. Using this method, means that you’re no better than the sister or brother that is sinning (living as a heritic and such).

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