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Mitt Romney Show Me Your Magic Mormon Underwear!

Posted by Job on June 22, 2007

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“Mr. Romney, show me your underwear!”  When asked about my recent statement
that ” a vote for Romney is a vote for satan,” Romney through his spokesman
replied, “”It shows that bigotry from time to time can still rear its ugly
head in society.”  The game in 2007 is to label anyone who has the audacity
to bring a Biblical worldview to the issues of the day as “hateful,”
“intolerant,” “a bigot,” or other names to try and discount what they say
and silence them.  Since Mr. Romney wants to try and dismiss me as simply a
“bigot,” I am publicly challenging him today to take off his jacket, open up
his shirt, and let the world see that as a “temple Mormon” and high priest
in this satanic cult he wears under his clothes literally 24/7 the sacred
undergarments of the priesthood given to him in the Temple ritual that bear

(  I was actually able to get a pair of the “magical underwear” as they are
often referred to, and wore them on the Liveprayer TV program Thursday
night, June 21st!  To see that program, go to:   )

For my new friend Barry Lynn of Americans United for Separation of Church
and State, like my previous message on how “a vote for Romney is a vote for
satan,” this message today has NOTHING TO DO WITH POLITICS, this is about
the eternal souls of men.  I have never told people who to or not to vote
for.  That is not what I do.  While your mission in life is to oppose the
work of God and watch people die and go to hell, my mission is to bring His
Truth to this dark world and lead people to everlasting life though faith in
Jesus Christ.

Mr. Romney, like all members of his satanic cult, is a LIAR!  He goes out on
the campaign trail and talks about his belief in God, Jesus, and the Bible,
and that he is just like any other Christian.  He has calculated that the
theologically ignorant and politically correct secular media will never have
the guts to challenge him on what he refers to as “his faith” or “his
church.”  Just moments before going on with Bill O’Reilly a few weeks ago,
in my earpiece came O’Reilly’s voice telling me that he did NOT want me to
get into the specific beliefs of Mormonism, that “he didn’t want to go
there.” The secular media on one hand really doesn’t care what their
theological beliefs are, and on the other hand, don’t want to be seen as
bashing someone’s “religion.”

Romney has been very clever and calculating in perpetuating the lie that he
is a “Christian” by attracting mainline evangelical figures like Jay Sekulow
and many others to support his candidacy. (My Note: Sekulow works for the organization founded, controlled, and funded by Pat Robertson). Sekulow and any other Christian leader that support Romney should be held accountable by the Christian
community for backing a member of a satanic cult that is leading the souls
of men to hell.  They have sold out the Truth of the Bible and Jesus Christ
just like Judas did for whatever short term political power they may receive
if Romney is elected.  There is NO justification for their endorsement and
support of a man whose influence will attract people to his cult, knowing
those who follow the lies of Mormonism will die and go to hell!

Here are just a few of the theological issues that makes the satanic Mormon
cult totally inconsistent with Biblical Christianity and why a Mormon is no
more a Christian than a Muslim is.  These are the things the lying Mr.
Romney won’t tell you, so I will.  The god of the Mormon cult is NOT the God
of the Bible.  Their “god” is named Elohim and was once a man like you and I
who came from another planet.  Mormon theology teaches that men can
eventually become a god and have their own planet.  Romney, as a member of
this cult, believes that he too will one day become a god.  When he talks
about “god,” he is talking about this fictitious god of Mormonism and NOT
the God of the Bible!

This holds true for Jesus.  The jesus of Mormon theology is not God
incarnate as the Bible teaches.  The Mormon jesus was not supernaturally
conceived by the Holy Ghost, but the natural offspring of their “god” Elohim
who had sex with Mary, meaning he is a created being no different than you
and I. Mormons also teach that their jesus had several wives and children,
again, in compete contradiction to what the Bible teaches.  The jesus of
Romney and the Mormon cult is also the brother of Lucifer and will return
not to the Mt. Of Olives as the Bible teaches, but to Independence, Missouri
to set up his earthly Kingdom.  When Romney talks about “jesus,” he is NOT
talking about the true Jesus of the Bible!

 *What Jesus you put your faith in is so critical, since this is why anyone
who puts their faith in the imaginary jesus of Joseph Smith and the satanic
Mormon cult will die in their sins and their souls burn forever in the
flames of hell!

What about the Bible and true Christian churches?  Mormons love to use the
Bible and quote from the Bible to support their deception that they are
Christians.  The trademark of all cults and false religions, even those who
use the Bible, is that it is NOT their final authority.  In the Mormon cult,
their authority does not come from the Bible which they view as incomplete
and not reliable, but the writings of Smith, the Book of Mormon, the Pearl
of Great Price, and the Doctrine and Covenants.  These are the writings that
form the false theology of this cult.  Romney and all Mormons believe that
non-Mormons are “abominations.”  While they don’t have the guts the Muslims
do to publicly call a non-Muslim an infidel who should be put to death, a
Mormon views a Biblical Christian as part of a “false religion” and void of
all authority.  Mitt Romney believes a Bible-believing Christian, the very
people he is courting so hard, are an abomination!

Like in all cults, the average member hasn’t got a clue what their cult
really believes. You only get to know everything after you have proven
yourself to be a loyal and worthy member of the cult.  That is true in the
Mormon cult as well.  Most Mormons go to their “church,” sing many of the
same hymns they sing at the Baptist church down the road, give their tithe,
read a few passages out of the Bible, hear a message about being a “good
person,” and go home.  It is only when you get to become a “temple Mormon”
that you really learn all of the deep, dark, beliefs of Mormonism.  The
Mormon temple rituals are actually little more than the temple rituals Smith
copied from another cult, Freemasonry!  Smith who was involved in the
Masonic cult, simply copied and incorporated their chants, handshakes, and
ceremonies when he started the Mormon cult.  These are the same chants,
handshakes, and ceremonies Romney participated in when he took his oath to
the Mormon cult above anything else, INCLUDING THE U.S. GOVERNMENT AND

The average person has no idea that the ultimate goal of the Mormon cult is
to establish a theocracy here in the United States.  Joseph Smith, the
cult’s founder actually ran for the Presidency.  So did Romney’s father.
This cult has the very real goal of establishing the “Kingdom of God,” which
means advancing the physical and earthly organization of the multi-billion
dollar Mormon cult.  There is a special room in the Mormon Temple located in
Washington, DC that has been prepared and in place for over 30 years, which
will be the seat of power for the Mormon-led government which will supplant
our current government.  This was the vision Smith laid out less than 200
years ago, and Mitt Romney and those in the hierarchy and leadership of the
Mormon cult see this as the time for that vision to become fulfilled!

I love you and care about you so much.  I have done my best in a limited
amount of time to give you a brief overview of the false and satanic beliefs
of the Mormon cult..  I have just barely scratched the surface, but just in
what I have shared with you today, NOBODY in their right mind could ever
believe that a Mormon is a Christian.  When you study Mormon theology and
understand the wild beliefs of Smith and this cult, you need faith greater
than I will ever hope to have to believe what they do.  There is no logic to
it and there is absolutely nothing they believe that has any basis in realty
or can be proven.  The mythical gold tablets Smith said he found .  Men who
become gods and have their own planet where they have many wives and create
“spirit babies.”  It all makes Star Trek look believable!

The Mormon cult shares some of the same scientific fantasies of the
Scientology cult dreamed up by that science fiction writer L. Ron Hubbard.
It also has some elements of the false religion of Islam in that they
believe all non-Mormons are an abomination and they will one day rule the
earth.  As I shared earlier, they have also taken some of the dark, satanic
rituals of the Masonic cult and incorporated them into their temple
ceremonies.  Listen, Mitt Romney and those in this cult can believe whatever
they want.  God gave us free will, and men who live in rebellion to God
since the very beginning have dreamed up the wildest and most ridiculous
things, and sadly people who were spiritually void chose to believe their
lies and will be lost for all eternity because of it.  My main  point is
that they be honest and truthful about what they believe.  The danger of
Mormonism is that they are deceptive (just look at their name, the Church of
Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints) and will lie without conscience  just
like the father of lies, satan (John 8:44), to get people to join their

The secular media has got to be responsible enough to tell people what the
Mormon cult really believes.  They can’t simply give Romney a pass when he
talks about “his faith” and “his church.”  They need to have the guts to
tell people what “his faith and church” really believe and challenge him
when he uses words like God, Jesus, and the Bible.  They don’t have to take
my word for it.  There is a wealth of information easily accessible out
there by thousands of people who were once part of this cult.  There is 100%
proof and documentation of all that this cult believes.  When you challenge
a Mormon on their beliefs, they will flat out lie to you.  In a recent
debate with Mormon apologist Scott Gordon on the Alan Colmes radio program,
I addressed many of the issues I have talked  about today, plus things like
their belief that you can pray for someone who is dead to be saved, their
belief Black people have been cursed, and each time he flat out LIED about
what they really believe.

So I am calling today for Mr. Romney to take off his jacket, unbutton his
shirt, and let the world see that he wears the sacred undergarments of the
priesthood  that bear the emblems of SATAN’S POWER AND PRIESTHOODS!  I am
calling on Mr. Romany to stop lying and deceiving people that he believes in
God, Jesus, and the Bible, and tell people the god he believes in used to be
a human being who evolved into his status as a god as he plans to one day,
that his jesus is not deity but a created being who can’t save your soul,
and the Bible is imperfect and his final authority are the writings of
Joseph Smith.  That is all I am asking Mr. Romney, TELL PEOPLE WHAT YOUR

***Ed Decker and his wife Carol are very dear friends as well as being part
of the Liveprayer family for many years now.  Ed is one of the world’s
leading and most sought after authorities on the Mormon cult, having been a
member of that cult for 20 years and a “temple Mormon,” until he came to
know the real Jesus 32 years ago.  Over the past 3 decades, Ed co-authored
the bestselling book “The God Makers,” and has written many other books and
created resources to help educate people about the truth of the Mormon cult.
He has also put his very life on the line to travel the world and help lead
people out of that darkness of Mormonism and into the light of the Truth of
God’s Word alone.  If you want to know all there is to know about the
satanic Mormon cult, please visit Ed’s ministry site:

In His love and service,
Your friend and brother in Christ,
Bill Keller

If I can help you in any way you can contact me through my personal email at:

***ARE YOU 100% CERTAIN WHERE YOU WILL SPEND ETERNITY?  The fact is you will die one day.  At that moment, you will either spend eternity with the Lord or
be cast into everlasting darkness forever separated from God your creator.
To know for certain you will be forever with Jesus, go to:

***I am excited to let you know that the Liveprayer Daily Devotional is now
available via AUDIO each day.  Simply go to
Also, you can now listen to the Daily Devotional by phone by calling,
1-845-510-2722 (C) Copyright 2007, Bill Keller Ministries. All rights reserved.

Please be praying for our attorney, David Gibbs III, as God uses his gifts
and talents to not only help Liveprayer, but many churches and ministries
deal with the legal issues that arise out of their service to our Lord.
Please take time to visit David’s website,


45 Responses to “Mitt Romney Show Me Your Magic Mormon Underwear!”

  1. Dave said

    Are the billions of people in Africa and China that have never heard of Jesus Christ, or had the chance to accept him going to go to Hell?

  2. Dave: There are several theological explanations for that issue that one can use and still remain an orthodox fundamentalist (meaning Bible – believing and practicing) Christian. All meaning Bible – believing and practicing people agree, however, that everyone who heard the gospel in their life will be judged on whether they received it or not, and that includes you by virtue of reading this Bill Keller devotional (and coming to my weblog), both of which have salvation message son it. I will not get into those in detail, but I will mention the most fascinating one in brief: remember, humans live in time and space in this life and on this earth. But when we die, we enter into eternity, where there is no time. The Bible says in Timothy that during the three days between Jesus Christ’s death and resurrection, He was in hell preaching to the lost. Since hell is a timeless eternity, everyone that ever lived on earth without hearing the gospel as a human heard it as a spirit during that time. So, hueing to that explanation, there really are no excuses; God made a way. Things that are impossible for man to even conceive of are routinely done and possible with God. It is not even that hard to imagine, really. I was listening to this radio ministry of the Messianic Jew Gary Headrick (, and he stated that one day God told him and someone that he was driving with to go buy groceries and give them to a specific house. So, they went, shopped for the groceries, and drove to the house. The hungry family HAD JUST STOPPED SAYING THEIR BRIEF PRAYER FOR FOOD. Now, of course, it took these men over an hour to go to a grocery store, buy the groceries, and take them to their house. WHICH MEANS THAT GOD TOLD THEM TO GO BUY GROCERIES FOR THIS FAMILY BEFORE THEY PRAYED! Why? Because God is omniscient, omnipresent, and omnipotent. He exists outside of time, and things that we are waiting to happen in the natural realm have already happened in the spirit realm; God has knowledge of it. So, God was able to send them to buy food in advance of their actual praying in the natural realm because in the spirit realm, they had already prayed. So, of course, if God is able to cause from the spirit realm for someone give food to someone before they ask Him for it in the natural realm, He is able to offer salvation to someone from the spirit realm through His Son preaching to them in hell before their natural lives. Now, of course, this is one view on this issue, and it isn’t even my own (which I shall not give). It is just something for you to think about, and realize that you cannot use that issue as an excuse to reject the true gospel of our God and Saviour Jesus Christ, and our God the Father and our God the Holy Spirit with Him.

  3. Jon said

    So let me get this straight, the members of the LDS church, who attend church every week, serve their neighbors, offer millions in humanitarian aid across the world and in general live clean upstanding lives and contribute to the betterment of society will all burn in hell? I echo Dave’s comment as well. For being a Christian, there seemed to be a lot of hate in your article.

  4. Jon: Kind Mormon, I did not produce this devotional, but rather reproduced the devotional originally authored by Bill Keller on my personal weblog as a service to Christianity. As for “the members of the LDS church, who attend church every week, serve their neighbors, offer millions in humanitarian aid across the world and in general live clean upstanding lives and contribute to the betterment of society”, you know perfectly well that Biblical Christianity holds that salvation is through faith in the birth, deity, and resurrection of Jesus Christ alone and not a function of works. Works are only the outgrowth of a sincere faith in and love for God. A person who truly believes in a sovereign spirit God and trusts Him for his salvation will inevitably produce works (with works produced and inspired by the Holy Spirit the only ones acceptable to God, not works of the flesh, which is what the Bible says over and over again, including the “God is a spirit, and you must worship Him in Spirit and in Truth” John 4:24 verse that you Mormons insist was mistranslated and was left out of the Joseph Smith translation altogether because you claim that God is flesh and bone and not a spirit), but those works are only the evidence of salvation, and not that which produces salvation. Jesus Christ Himself said in Matthew 7:21-23 that most of those who produce good works in His Name will be rejected by God. So, according to the true Bible, your church attendance and humanitarian works won’t save you. Wiccans and even atheists are perfectly capable of those. Only faith in the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit (note that it was only the Father and the Son that was alleged to have visited Joseph Smith where all three visited Abraham) as being God and solely responsible for your salvation based on the birth, death, and resurrection of the Son will save you. And as far as works go, Mormons teach that Adam and Eve did a good work in disobeying God because that paved the way for pre – existing spirits to have lives on earth and advance to godhood. So in your religion, it appears that even evil works, direct transgressions of God’s direct explicit commands to an individual (which Jews called the sin of a high hand, the greatest sin, and God did not give the Jews a sacrifice to take that sin away) are valued.

  5. DDustin said

    The author of this post refuses to talk about what LDS people believe. Instead he focuses on the fringe statements made by some members of the LDS church. LDS people believe in a canon of scripture, and in authoritative statements issued by the first presidency. If you are going to argue against the LDS church at least characterize your argument to what we as a church and individuals are taught and believe. Saying that any one individual like Brigham Young or Bruce R Mcconkie said something does not make it a doctrine of our church. If your concern is that our beliefs are leading us and others to Hell; than focus on what we believe not statements that are easy to argue about.

  6. DDustin: Brigham Young succeeded Joseph Smith as the leader of the Mormon movement and you all consider him a prophet with his teachings valid. Why do you waste your time with lies? And Bill Keller’s entire point is that Mitt Romney – and Mormons in general – do not tell people what they believe because they want to deceive people into believing that Mormons believe the same thing as Christians; that Mormons also regard God as an omnipotent omniscient omnipresent self – existing spirit and believe in an uncreated Jesus Christ that died to wash away their original sin. I will say this: if Mitt Romney truly wants his faith to “not matter”, then he needs to stop going around telling Christians that “Jesus is my savior.” Or at least he needs to tell them that he regards them as false Christians part of “the great apostasy” for not believing that God was a man who progressed to godhood by following universal laws that pre – existed him and himself had a father who was also a man, has wives in heaven, etc. and as such the best that they can hope for is the lowest level of Mormon heaven (along with rapists, thieves, child molesters, and basically everyone but mass murderers and apostate Mormons). Or am I wrong about that too? Look, Bill Keller deals with former Mormons all the time, and as for me I have three books in my possession written or co – written by guys who spent decades in your cult. So quit your lies and pretensions that Christian critics of Mormonism are lacking in facts concerning your beliefs. You are wasting your time, and though you may fool some people (though not me) for a time, when it comes to eternity you are only fooling yourself.

  7. Jon said

    Well, Dustin, it looks like we will just have to resign ourselves to the fact that healtheland will tell us what we believe. Rational discussion with the irrational is impossible.

  8. BD said

    If people that share your attitude and beliefs populate heaven, please send me to hell with Romney. I would much rather spend eternity is his presence than yours.

  9. BD: Since my beliefs come from a clear, literal, and contextual interpretation of the Bible then you both the Bible and the God who wrote it. Thank you for making that crystal clear.

  10. DDustin said

    Once again you choose to use common misrepresentations of our believes colluded with non authoritative statements. You say that we are misleading people. In truth we are telling people what we believe. We teach in our church canonized scripture. We teach what is said in statements made by the first presidency. Those are the things we believe. You are telling people that we are misleading the masses. The truth is that your diatribe is common but still not true. You misrepresent our belief.

  11. Jon said

    Now it’s getting to the point of pure entertainment. Does your research consist of googling the word “Mormon” and then believing whatever it is you find? I don’t get why you are so hell bent on proving Mormonism a satanic cult. I mean sure, if we were trying to drag the world into illicit sex, drugs and prostitution, I might understand. Though we might have some differences, it seems to me that we have enough common beliefs to work towards making the world a better place to live.

  12. This blog seems to eminate with the kind of hate I have experienced at the hand of Evengelicals.
    The problem of evangelicals playing the ‘cult’ card is they have a narrow view of what the Bible teaches. While I am not an LDS nor do agree with a lot of their teachings (such as Jesus being the brother of Satan, which does NOT make them Satan worshippers), I find persons such as James Dobson who may a very good (and admittedly more Orthodox) interpretation of the Bible severely lacking in one major biblical principle; that is the “love the Lord your God with all your heart and love your neighbor as yourself”.
    I used to attend a Baptist church and after illnesses, my son’s autism diagnosis, my wife’s nervous breakdown, our Baptist ‘friends’ were none too happy to throw us to the wolves. Needless to say, I have found much more support and less hypocritical judgments from Mormons to this very day (as many false rumors are STILL perpetuated among evangelicals in my community.

  13. Jon: Don’t flatter yourself. Mormonism only takes up a small fraction of the content on this weblog.

  14. Carl Strohmeyer: Do you believe the Bible to be literally true, Holy Spirit inspired, inerrant, and the final authority in all matters? If so, then you know that loving your neighbor is not allowing him to believe a lie and die in his sins without opposing the lie with the truth (God will require it at your hand if you do, it says so in Ezekiel 3 and 33), and loving God with all your strength means promoting and defending the faith at all costs. I am sorry for the evil that you have suffered at the hands of those who call themselves Christians; I have experienced similar evil and my family members even worse. But that is no excuse for turning from the Bible because the Bible itself said that those very things would happen.

  15. Jon said

    I never indicated anything to the contrary about the content of your blog. This is actually the only article I’ve read on your blog. I guess all I am saying is the following: I can understand that people might take issue with some of the things the LDS church believes, but fundamentally I think most of America believes in serving your neighbor and bettering the world we live in. These are fundamental beliefs to the LDS church as well. Why not focus on working together on that. I’m fairly certain nobody is truly converted to anything meaningful through hate.

  16. Jon: Go read your Bible and see all the references in it about all the things that God hates. You know, sin, false doctrine, false religion, rebellion, witchcraft, false teaching, false prophets and preachers? Your problem is not with me, but with the Bible. I am serving my neighbor and bettering my world through the promotion and defense of true Bible – based Christianity, and yes God has used me to win converts. My belief is centered around the glorification of God, not diminishing God to a mere “superman” so that I can exalt myself through works so that I can achieve some fantasy notion of approaching equality with him by advancing to what you call godhood. The Bible says “with God all things is possible”, but the Mormon god cannot even truly create; he can only organize pre – existing matter. The Mormon god cannot supernaturally beget, but rather had Jesus Christ through natural procreation with Virgin Mary. So, yes, I am making the world a better place by speaking of what Mormons truly believe and challenging Mormons as to why they won’t speak publicly of it. Mormons may do good works, but one must consider the motive for those works: so that you can achieve equality with the false image of a god that you have shrunk to a mouse so that you can become equal with it.

  17. Jon said

    Again, I never said I had a problem with you. Best of luck in your quest to make the world a better place and I will continue doing the same.

  18. steffielynn said

    Hi Healtheland, it’s been awhile. I’m sure you didn’t miss me though 🙂

    So I’m really disgusted by this article by Bill Keller. Why you would post an article by a hateful judgemental “Christian” is so beyond me, but hey it’s your blog.

    But this is my question, why would anyone be concerned with Mitts underwear? And why would anyone want him to strip down so they can see it? Doesn’t that strike you as extremely odd? They have a special meaning and are sacred and the only person who should see his underwear is his wife!

    I am so grateful that I understand and respect these special blessings.

    The Garments are not “magical” and just by Bill Keller saying this, shows he is mocking us and is totally way off. I hope that you consider listening to the Latter Day Saints themselves instead of listening to the ever so hateful and incorrect Bill Keller!

    I hope you are having a Fabulous summer!

  19. “Do you believe the Bible to be literally true, Holy Spirit inspired, inerrant, and the final authority in all matters?”
    Mostly Yes and some no. The way many evangelicals do even on cultural issues such as slavery or women, I would say no. However on the whole (with a very few exceptions such as 1 Cor 10:13) I would say 99% yes.

    And quoting Jesus in Matt. 7:16 and following: “You will know them by their fruits” and “A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit”

    There are Mormons who believe in the Lord for their salvation (even with some of the un orthodox beliefs) and a whole lot of Evengelicals from my experience whose fruit show they do not.

    By the way love does not drive a person to suicide by condeming them for their sins whether real or perceived (and in the case of Evangelicals, usually perceived).

  20. Savea said


    Who is Satan’s father?

    If God created us in His image, then who created Satan?

    Have you ever lied before?

    If you’ve never lied before, then I will believe in every word from you. I was taught that the only person who was perfect was Jesus Christ.

  21. Savea: The Bible says that by Jesus Christ were all things made. So that means that Jesus Christ created Satan and the angels. That is not a problem with Christians, for Christians know that Jesus Christ is God, as Jesus Christ is called in scripture. Even Mary called Jesus Christ her God while He was yet in her womb. But Mormons deny the deity of Jesus Christ and claim that Jesus Christ was a created being. Which, of course, makes Him equal with Satan. And yes, Jesus Christ was the only One perfect. But that is because Jesus Christ was GOD. By denying the deity of Jesus Christ, you claim that a man can be perfect. So, I do not have to be perfect, for the Blood of God redeems me. Since you deny the deity of Jesus Christ, you are the one who has to be perfect. Otherwise you will be convicted to death under the law which you cannot keep, and your sentence will be carried out when God’s angels cast you into the lake of fire for eternity.

  22. Savea said


    Thank you for your answer. Please, help me with the following questions:

    Why did Jesus create Satan knowing that it will cause many people to commit sins and fall away from the truth?

    Did Jesus create Satan to fullfill his atonement for our sins and many other events mentioned in the Bible?

    If Jesus didn’t create Satan, then there would have been no sin on earth from Adam and Eve to this day, would you agree?

    Was Satan created to fullfill

  23. Yes, Mitt Romney has a lot that he is hiding. He believes that the Book of Mormon is ancient American history and he does wear wierd underwear.

  24. Donna: Does he have a right to his beliefs and to be President? Yes. Does he have a right to mislead Christians concerning his beliefs? Not without opposition from Christians who know the truth!

  25. Johnny Putt said

    The book of Mormon has scientificly
    proven to be full of sh..Smithy
    wangling the book of Abraham from
    an Egyptian scroll also falls in that
    catagory. Dig into his parents
    history. Both Lucy Mack (Mother)
    and Joe Sr. had a reputation for
    seeing boogymen spirits and preaching
    about them. If you look at the
    history of these Salem Witch Burning
    Clans and how it rubbed off on young
    Joe, you’ll agree that Jack and the
    Beanstock has more credibility than
    that Mormon crap.

  26. Chris said

    Oh my gosh, so @#$% boring. What a load of @#$%. Why are you so @#$%-bent on attacking the Mormon faith?

    I know you say that you just reproduced it, you must share these beliefs thought otherwise you wouldn’t have posted it.

    As for faith without works, what the hell. Let’s see how far just your faith will get you. You need to do the works also.

    Try thinking for yourself and why not write about your OWN experiences of dealing with Latter-day Saints – or do you not have any and that is why you reproduced this?

    People like you make me sick, purporting to be christians and then find it totally acceptable to attack another for their beliefs. I don’t know where in the bible Jesus taught that it was ok to attack another because of beliefs. Surely that isn’t Christlike to do that. Then, doesn’t that make you not a true christian because of this?

    Think about it, and I mean really think about it.

  27. Chris:

    “I don’t know where in the bible Jesus taught that it was ok to attack another because of beliefs.” Chris, either you are a liar, or you have never actually read the Bible. Very likely it is both.

  28. Chris,
    I have objection to Mormon faith, but I do not have a problem with the people. They have been kind to me, and I have always shown my love to them and have had great conversations with them.
    I have a problem with their views and beliefs which run contrary to the Torah, especially since Joseph Smith has claimed that the American Indian tribes are a part of the Ten Lost Tribes. They have these geneologies that can not be proven. The book of Mormon runs contrary to the character of G_d, and instead are promised that they will someday rule a planet as a god. This is a deep problem for me. This is what Mormons have told me. It is a common story among them. Whether it is fringe teaching, or a common one, it carries with it the words of Satan…”I shall ascend above the throne of G_d, and be like G_d.” The theology of having one’s own planet to rule falls in line with the fact that Satan was given the earth for dominion. Doesn’t that sound familiar? G_d never said that we would have our own planet. This is at the core of my objection to Mormon faith. Second, is this “tie” they think they have to the Jewish people. Third is the symbolisms that are used in the “temples” themselves. They are occultic symbols, and if they believe in the one true G_d, they should not have even entertained the thought of including occultic symbols into the walls of their temples.
    Another problem that I have with them is the elite company that they keep, and their unique involvement with Israel.
    I do not even wish to get into their belief’s of Jesus Christ, and because their views of Jesus run contrary to the bible, their Jesus is not the Savior.
    Another interesting thing that I have noticed on a different note, is that for the past year, from the pulpit in “TV churches” there has been a lot of talk about this “Latter Rain.” The Latter Blessings, and on and on. Don’t you find it interesting that all this “Latter” talk has made it quite agreeable for Christians who in the past opposed Mormon teaching, to now some how accept, and in many cases, support a LATTER DAY Saint?
    It is so subtle, don’t you think?
    As far as a Mormon being president goes…
    He is no different to me than any other politician. No matter what his faith shall be. I will not follow any politician. Each of them hold contrary views to that of G_d, and because of it, I can not vote for “the lesser of two evils.”
    If I were to consider voting, (which I am not) I may lean towards Ron Paul. Anyone that would take control from the banks, return us back to the gold standard, and run the country according to the constitution, would have my eyebrow raised. Ron Paul has an impeccable record, and the fact that he has been “hushed” from the media, is an indication that he is actually on the right track. Ron Paul is dangerous to the banks, and to politics in general. If he were some how voted in, I doubt that he would live very long. Everyone knows that.
    That is a shame.

  29. Eden Hadassah: Thanks, I agree 100%. Huckabee is the only candidate that would take on the big banks, or globalism in general. Have you heard this business about “the amero” and “the North American Union” (similar to the euro and the EU)? I am convinced that both parties are wrecking our economy on purpose to bring that in. And yes, two of my posts on here do talk about how the Kennedys were killed because they wanted to get us back on the gold standard. As for Mormon Mitt Romney? International investment banker. That is why George W. Bush and all of these Council on Foreign Relations backed religious right flunkies are backing him.

    Here are the posts that I was speaking of earlier:

  30. Off the subject a little…
    The 40 days of purpose.
    40 seems to be the number! Here is an interesting link, not to the 40 days of purpose, but what the number 40 means in the Torah and Talmud.
    You might find it interesting if you read it, and see what you can pick up on from the rabbi’s.

  31. Chris said

    Healtheland: I am not a liar and I have read the bible.

    I stand by my comment, you can’t be a true christian if you are attacking others because of their beliefs. This is definatley not a teaching that comes from Jesus Christ.

    It is totally contrary to his teachings. It’s sad that you don’t think so though.

    It would lead me to believe that you are a liar AND have never read the bible

  32. Chris,
    According to your own beliefs, did you just condemn yourself by your words, as a true christian?

    “I stand by my comment, you can’t be a true christian if you are attacking others because of their beliefs. This is definatley not a teaching that comes from Jesus Christ.”

    Aren’t you attacking HTL for his beliefs?

  33. Chris: Ummm, Jesus Christ denounced the beliefs of the Pharisees and Saduccees on a constant basis. You may have stared at the pages of the Bible, but you did not READ it, because your interpretation was tainted by false doctrines, very likely Mormonism. What is more, are you not aware that Mormons bash Christians all the time? They have toned it down in recent years – at least in public – because their growth is declining and they need to moderate and homogenize their image to gain new converts. But in times past, Mormons used to launch scathing diatribes against actual Christians. You do not know the Bible, and you do not know the history of the Mormon church. So precisely what do you know?

    Eden Hadassah: Thank you for catching that fellow in his hypocrisy. The people who claim “criticizing the beliefs of others is wrong” are usually the fastest to do just precisely that.

  34. Chris said

    Eden: I merely made a comment. If you have interpreted the comment as an attack then I apologise. I am not attacking HTL because of his beliefs, it was just a comment.

    HTL: I have not been tainted by false doctrines. I have read the bible. Denouncing a belief is not the same as attacking someone for it. I denounce homosexuality, but I have friends who practice this. I do not attack them for it, I will stay friends with them, I just don’t agree with the practice.

    I spent a number of years going to different churches where I live and the only church that I found that made sense was The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

    I do not bash other Christians. I respect the beliefs of other people, although I might not agree with them. They are entitled to believe in what they want to – as am I. I have Muslim and Catholic neighbours. I don’t agree with what they believe in but it certainly doesn’t make me ignore them or bash them. They are my friends and as such I treat them as friends.

    I fail to see how I am a hypocrite. I don’t criticise others for their beliefs and all I am asking is the same courtesy for my beliefs.

  35. Chris: Still have not dealt with the fact that Jesus Christ denounced the beliefs of the Pharisees and Sadducees. You made a false claim and I called you on it. And you can call yourself a Christian but it doesn’t make it true. You are not a Christian. Your beliefs are completely different from and incompatible with mine. You worship a different god from mine. Your theology is completely different from mine. Mormonism has nothing in common with Christianity. Islam is closer to Christianity than is Mormonism. Why do Mormons pretend otherwise?

  36. Chris:

    Can you tell me what it is that made sense to you about the Latter Day Saints?
    I would like to know whether your choice was a spiritual one or an emotional one or maybe both.

  37. Chris said

    HTL: I am a christian. I worship the same God you do. I believe in the same Jesus Christ you do.

    As I said, denouncing something and attacking something are completely different.

    It is true that our beliefs do differ in some way. As do yours from Islam and as do Islam from Judaism.

    Mormonism has everything to do with christianity. The full name of the church is The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. I fail to see where you get the fact that we are not christian.

    You are attacking me for my beliefs. I am not attacking you for yours. I respect you for what you believe in. It is solely your choice – as it is mine. I would thank you not to attack me for it.

  38. Chris said

    Eden: Everything about the LDS church made sense to me. It follows the pattern of the ancient Church of Christ. That was important to me.

    It was a spiritual choice. I read the literature of the church. I prayed to God asking him to help me make the right choice. He helped me indeed. The right choice was to join the LDS church.

    I am more happy now than I ever was before

  39. Chris,
    How is the ancient church of Christ like the mormon church?
    I have not read any thing in the scriptures about a mother and father god. Nor have I ever read that I could have my own planet someday. Unfortunately, only luciferian doctrine teaches this. That is not a judgement, but the actual thought process of Satan himself.

    Also it is taught by mormons that Jesus is a separate god from the Father. He was created as a spirit child by the father and mother in heaven and is the elder brother of all men and spirit beings. His body was created through sexual union between elohim and Mary. Jesus was married. His death on the cross does not provide full atonement for all sin, but does provide everyone with resurrection… Also they teach that the holy spirit is different from the holy ghost. That the holy spirit is not G_d, but is an influence or electricity-like emanation from G_d or the light of Christ. Also that they are resurrected by grace, but saved and exalted to godhood by works, including faithfulness to church leaders, mormon baptism, tithing, ordination, marriage, and secret temple rituals. No eternal life without mormon membership. That eventually nearly everyone goes to one of three separate heavenly kingdoms, with some achieving godhood. Apostates and murderers go to outer darkness.

    Now, none of these fundimental beliefs of the mormon religion resembles Christianity. On the contrary, the L_rd Yeshua/Jesus himself said to beware of false christs that will come stating that “I am he.”
    If the mormon doctrine is in anyway contrary to the word of G_d and to his character, it is false doctrine. As far as I understand, the mormons use the same version of scriptures, “The King James Version” if I am not mistaken, yet even in the King James Version will we not find any of these tenents of the mormon faith.

    So I have to conclude that your decision to join the Latter Day Saints is based purely on their literature and therefore could not be based on spiritual faith. Because you have said that you are more happy now then ever before, then indeed your choice was based on emotion, according to your own words. There is a difference between joy and happiness. Joy is a fruit of the Spirit, and happiness is human emotion.
    What I wrote about the mormon church is not a judgement, but a fact according to the mormon church. If you disagree with the things that I have written about the mormon church, then you were led into the church and decieved. All that I have written about the mormon beliefs are what they believe, not my attack on them. I do not agree with these beliefs, because every one of them contradicts the word of G_d.
    I encourage you to read through their doctrinal statements of faith, and compare them to what is written in the accepted canon of scripture. My challange for you personally, at home, is for you to prove that what they have said is true, with chapter and verse from the bible, (not the book of mormon), and prove it to yourself. Test this doctrine for yourself and see if it is truly from G_d. If you are truly seeking to know and worship G_d, then prove your devotion to him, and find all that the mormons believe in the accepted cannon of scriptures for yourself. Ask him to reveal himself to you in a way that he has never done. If you find that you can not prove each of the doctrinal tenents of their faith and yours in the word of G_d, then repent. Tell the L_rd that you will not accept anything less than the truth, and that you seek to know him. He is the only way, the only truth, and the only life for now and forever more. He is the King of Glory, radiant and Holy! He is the messiah. He is my only L_rd. He and the Father are one, and there is only one Holy Spirit, and the Holy Spirit is one with the Father and the Son.

    There is no mother and father god. Jesus was raised from the dead through the power of the Holy Spirit, and is now and forever more seated at the right hand of G_d the Father. This is what christians believe, and they believe nothing less then that.

    Can you say that Jesus is the only way, truth and life?
    That He, the Father and the Holy Spirit are one God? Can you do this?
    If you can not, then we are not one, you are not a christian, nor are you saved through Jesus the messiah.
    Reverand Sun Myong Moon thinks that he is Jesus. Does that make his followers christians?
    I am not attacking your faith, but I am questioning it. There is a difference. I encourage you to question your faith too, because if you are not worshipping him in Spirit and in Truth, then it is false worship and it is idolatry.
    I know that I have written alot here, and I have many questions, but I ask you these things because I love, not because I sit in judgement. I am asking for you to judge for yourself. I believe that you wouldn’t even visit this site unless you had questions deep with in your soul.

    I hope you will recieve my words with the love and grace that pours from my soul to you.


  40. johnkaniecki said


    Please allow me to jump in. I hope you are well. I wouldn’t take anything that happens on these blogs personal and it appears from your writings that you don’t. Healtheland’s blog is one that is very scrutinizing. We have a profound faith in Jesus Christ and the Word of God. As such and because this is an open forum things occur here that perhaps wouldn’t in other aspects of life. For you see these comments are open to the general public to see. Therefore the comments are not only between the participants but are also made with those who will read them as well.

    You mention the Mormonism follows the ancient Church of Christ. I belong to the Church of Christ but certainly not the Mormon one. The Church of Christ initially was very big at getting back into the original Word of God. The Church of Christ that I became part of taught me that we shouldn’t listen to the Pope, Luther, Calvin or many others but instead examine the Word of God for guidance. Though theologians may have many valid points to make they are not a substitute for the Bible. There are some churches who follow Calvin more closely than Jesus for example. While they won’t say this in that way an examination of the doctrine they profess to believe would.

    Let me point out the biggest problem in your thinking. If as you say you would like to follow the pattern of the early New Testament Church or as you say the “pattern of the ancient Church of Christ” you must realize the following.

    The ancient Church of Christ had no Book of Mormon nor A Pearl of Great Price or anything else the Mormons consider sacred. Though I am certainly not an expert on these books there are as Eden points out problems. Therefore at some point you must choose whether to follow the Bible’s teachings or the doctrines added over a millenium later.

    Furthermore the ancient Church of Christ had Jesus as it’s head and each congregation was autonomous. The spiritual oversight of the congregation was conducted by elders.

    Also I have met missionaries from the Mormon Church. I am aware there are at least two sects of Mormonism and there are probably many more. I would add that these two young men referred to themselves as elders. They were polite and seemed concerned about me. I told them to read the books of 1 Timothy and Titus to learn what an elder’s qualifications were. Among the qualifications it is stated that elders must be married men with faithful children and not novices in the faith. These men were not married and at just over twenty years in age obviously not men of vast experience.

    I would quite readily point out the scripture in the Bible where Jesus said to call no man on Earth father because our Father is in heaven. To this day I refer to my physical father as dad. I certainly would never call a catholic “preist” father.

    If you would like to follow the “pattern of the Ancient Church of Christ” then there is obviously a conflict here. While a casual reader may think the points I’ve mentioned are trivial, they are not. This is God’s Word we are talking about not some philosophy book. The more fundamental problems, as Eden has pointed out do also exist. I care not to speak about them because she has mentioned them. I could go on and talk about how Joseph Smith died, in a gun battle. I called talk about how the Mormons treatment of the Utes and I am referring modern as well as older history. I could talk about the lack of archeological evidence to validate the book of Mormon in contrast to the Bible. I called talk about the fact that people of African descent were excluded from your Church until recently.

    Once again it’s nothing personal. The way the Puritans treated the natives is just as disgusting as the way the Mormons did. The Catholic Inquisition and many other things makes me realize they are wrong. Especially when these evils have not been denounced by the church. (I don’t know if the Mormons have denounced their treatment of the Utes.)

    I follow Jesus and my authority is the Word of God. If a man, any man teaches something that is contrary to the Word of God I must stand against that. Now if I knew you personally I would develop a relationship with you and certainly not present these facts in anyway that would be misconstrued as an attack. (I would develop a relationship with you because I love you not to prove you are wrong.) Yet as I mentioned this is an open forum for discussing matters. Eden, Healtheland and I have presented many things to you. I await your response.



    PS Where do you live by the way?

  41. Chris: “It follows the pattern of the ancient Church of Christ.” Sure, if you ignore everything about the ancient church that was written in the New Testament and by the early church writers. There is no historical or archaeological evidence whatsoever that Mormonism bears any sort of resemblance to the early church, just as there is no historical or archaelogical evidence of any of the people or places mentioned in the Book of Mormon. The only reason why you believe it to be so is because Joseph Smith said so. Chris, you are willing to believe whatever you want, but do not think that you are going to get away with lying on history here.

  42. Lauren said

    I wanted to pop in, as I found this blog by accident (well, not really if your believe the One True Living God may have directed me here.) Eden, you and all of the Christians on this blog are an inspiration to me. I pray day after day for everyone’s salvation, no matter what they believe in. I just don’t understand, as a Christian, how people can worship human beings. My dear sweet Jesus, the most important thing in my universe, the ONE beaten, bruised and battered beyond discription so that we can be reborn and try, as hard as we can to walk in His footsteps as close as humanly possible. This entire story from the top is sad. But I wanted to thank you all for presenting your cases. To our morman friends: I am just another Christian who will sit in prayer for hours tonight, and every day and every night for you. My Savior loves, He lives and He doesn’t want me to spew hatred. But, just as Eden and the others said, Mormanism is of the devil, and Mr. Romney, hell will freeze over before I ever cast a vote for you. I honestly would rather be shot and go Home to the ONE TRUE LIVING GOD before I ever listened of let myself become a a part of this….this dangerous, lying bunch. And to think that lonely, impressionalbe people will be taken in by this slick-looking politician. Sweet Jesus, my Lord and Savior, please help them. I will pray for you. All of the non-believers. I was there once, and I do not believe one can speak the truth, unless they have been there. (An unbeliever) Oh, how I love my life today! Thank You Father, Jesus and Holy Spirit. After reading all of this, studying this and now an opportunity to voice it, I fill that any void that I had in my life was filled when I recieved Jesus. I have NEVER had a prayer go unanwered. NOT ONE. (No, I don’t ask the Father to give me the winning lottery ticket) This has been such an eye-opening experience this evening. So, all the glory goes to the Lord for having me “stumble” across this. And here I was taking so much time to pray for Muslims’ to come to Christ, now I see with eyes wide open, there is even more danger in this world than just the radical jihadists. It’s sitting around, pretty silent, until I start opening my mouth after this blessing! Thank you, and I’ll keep an eye on this weblog.
    In Christ,

  43. Lauren: Thank you for your radical witness sister in Christ Jesus!

  44. LastSkeptic said

    Hell would be a ball compared to listening to the contortions of faith that fundies come up with. The holly spit must be a cruel beast to torture people with such absurdity. For christ’s sake, accept your doubts and puke this crap out of your peanut size minds…and be free of guilt and that bastard child molesting preacher who sucks your mind with his inerrant ignorance.

  45. Josh said

    don’t you have anying better to do? get a job man

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