Titus 1:5-9 the Apostle Paul repeats these qualifications of a bishop/elder/pastor (the same Greek word episkopos is used) in his letter to Titus. He made know distinction between the elder and the bishop. He writes, “For this reason I left you in Crete, that you should set in order the things that are lacking, and appoint elders in every city as I commanded you. If a man is blameless, the husband of one wife, having faithful children not accused of dissipation or insubordination. For a bishop must be blameless, as a steward of God, not self-willed, not quick-tempered, not given to wine, not violent, not greedy for money, but hospitable, a lover of what is good, sober-minded, just, holy, self-controlled, holding fast the faithful word as he has been taught, that he may be able, by sound doctrine, both to exhort and convict those who contradict.”

Term term elder found in the new testament is always plural in number, never an elder alone, or a minister alone. This is how the first church functioned, and you are right there is (some) European culture involved in church today but most comes from a mixture of pagan practices under Constantine. It was under his rule that the buildings we see today took their shape. In the first church all people ministered with the apostles or elders watching over to insure the word was being divided correctly, yet there was no distinction between elders and laity.

Under Constantine distinctions were made, such as dress and position.
In the first church they met in houses and all fellowshipped together, however this changed and buildings were made, seats arranged, and those not taking part in service would listen. A throne was set up in the center of the church for the bishop and this reflected his position as a imperial servant as well as the pastor over the flock.

We see this same thing in churches toda.

Hope you are well.

The pastor is not in charge but the elder. Titus 1 and 1 Timothy 3. That is if there are qualified elders.

There is too much influence of European culture in the church. Jesus is the head of the church. Some people say this but don’t mean it. Ultimately it is before Him that we must account for all we have done.

Remember that when Israel wanted a king God told Samuel that they were rejecting him. I Peter 5 states the elders are not to Lord over. That is they rule by example.

There are too many dictatorships in the church. This is not how it was intended to be. We are to serve one anothere in Love and humility.

Love,

John

“He must hold firm to the trustworthy word as taught, so that he may be able to give instruction in sound doctrine and also to rebuke those that contradict it.”

Not every word, every new revelation or every prophecy is from God. The body of Christ is the test bed for all new revelation (not the pastor) because the spirit of God is present in believers, and the spirit will either agree or not agree. Jesus identified so closely with the curch that it can be said that in the body of Christ is where hidden treasures of wisdom and knowledge are.
So yes, recongize the shepard, yet it is the body of Christ where all things end and begin.
The first church was not like the one we see today. They understood this fact and there was no one man overseeing the body, but all thing worked together for good.

Hope you are well.

Who is a pastor but a servant of God?

Talking about Elders in Titus 1 verse 9. “He must hold firm to the trustworthy word as taught, so that he may be able to give instruction in sound doctrine and also to rebuke those that contradict it.”

If a pastor is not doing what the Word of God says he has not authority.

Love,

John

Now vinne, you said my biblical researches are just theory, what are you researching?

You said: if he the pastor doesn t keep his believers in order with the word of God, i have to take my measures.

Vinne you can come to the pastor with a problem that you may see but you must remember that God is holding the pastor accountable, not you. I once went to a elder who was sleeping with one of the women in the church. I told him I knew what was going on and that he should stop, repent and ask for forgiveness. He replied, “what if I tell you I’am going to do what I do anyhow.” My only response to someone who already knows was “that is between you and God.” He said “thank you.” and continued doing what he knew was wrong. From the moment I spoke with him my hands were clean. God had used me to warn him. I did. And that was all God wanted, not to move against him and make him stop. That was the pastors place, not mine.
Many times I see things wrong and have gone to a pastor and things remained the same. God does not hold me accountable once I did what was right, and that is to bring it to the pastors attention and then remain in prayer about it.

Vinne this is not good. You wrote: he thing im a rebell,just because i see more then i should see. last sunday we had a cup óf cofee together ,and i ve told him if my word of discernment bothers him,(PASTOR);i ll shut my mouth for ever. he didn t anwswer me.

Vinne, there are times when we want things to go right and to be in order, but we speak out of order. By that I mean we bring our concerns to the pastor and and when things don’t happen we began to question him as to why.
Remember Korah questioned the authority of Moses and Aaron, even though God chose them as the leaders of the people. There was a reason Korah questioned Moses. It was his distant cousin who was the rightful heir to the promise, not Joseph. But because Ruben sinned and defiled his fathers bed, the promise fell on the first born from the second marriage. Korah wanted to lead the people back to Eygpt.
Each of us must learn to not abruse their gifts and to have humility. If after telling the pastor your concerns you don’t see change you should continue in your walk with God and pray that the pastors eyes will be open to the problem.
Anything that distracts you from your walk with God is not of God. The devil is looking for a foothold into this church and you should shut the door and continue with the pastor using your gift as the Lord would led. Before speaking ask the Holy Spirit to direct your steps.

Vinne wrote the following: evey move of my church is written down on my little book, dont tell why i do this .. thank you for your understanding.

Throw the book away. It will only cause you to hold on to past things that you view as wrong and it will hold you back from moving forward. Remember, in our Christian walk we are either moving forward or backward, we are never at a stand still even though some may think we are.Just as God wipes away our sins when we ask him to forgive us, we should forgive also, and the little book means you are holding on.

Vinne your last statement so touched my heart. you said,God tells me i have to stay and wait til i ll grow,then ….He will tell me where to go

That is correct. You are there to grow and put up with all manner of things. I had to stay in a church for years. God told me I was there to learn how not to be. I learned what the pastor was doing wrong and to not make the same mistakes, and it was only after years of God teaching me that he finally released me to go somewhere else.